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ibfoxy1
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« on: January 27, 2012, 08:32:49 PM »

I was wondering if you can use an external hard drive like a regular hard drive? What I want to do is play my games on an external hard drive. The hard drive on my computer is getting pretty full.  And I would like to keep more than one game going at a time.
I have a Dell XPS 630i, Windows XP Pro.
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« Reply #1 on: January 27, 2012, 10:35:44 PM »

It is not clear why you just don't put manpower Hard Drive inside your Desktop. That is a full size desktop - right?

Dell XPS 630i
http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/xps630i/en/OM/HTML/specs.htm
Can't see where it tells if there are extra bays. There should be.

In any desktop that does not have a spare bay, take out the floppy or DVD drive abed use the bay for another HDD. You can get external DVD  case for about the same price as an eternal HDD case.

Avoid external HDD unless you have a need for it. Like portable backup.
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ibfoxy1
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« Reply #2 on: January 28, 2012, 04:14:40 AM »

 I was given the external drive for christmas, and was hoping to be able to use it.
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Allan
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« Reply #3 on: January 28, 2012, 05:44:18 AM »

Yes, as far as your system is concerned the external drive is essentially the same as an internal drive - you can run programs from it.
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truenorth
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« Reply #4 on: January 28, 2012, 09:12:22 AM »

To confirm what Allan says and to respectfully disagree with Geek i am using at least 4 external Hdd's with everything under the sun on them and they perform as do internals. Plus they give me the advantage of the portability of taking their content for use on a variety of computers. If you have a spare internal 2.5 or 3.5 cases to convert them to externals are readily available and very inexpensive.truenorth
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« Reply #5 on: January 28, 2012, 10:45:22 AM »

I give up.   :'(
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Raptor
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« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2012, 10:51:32 AM »

I give up.   :'(

I agree with you. External hard drives are way more likely to be abused and poorly cooled. Not to mention that USB as an interface isn't as reliable as having a dedicated SATA or PATA interface.

Also, external hard drives most of the time aren't properly grounded which is just bad for computer equipment.

If you intend on using a hard drive on a daily matter, it should be inside the computer for best results.
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« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2012, 12:04:57 PM »

I agree with Geek-9pm (there is a first time for everything).

While I don't understand the common cite that "USB is less reliable than ATA" (as a protocol), the fact is that being external to the case makes it more "unreliable"; it's easier for a person to accidentally unplug it, (either it's data or power cable) while it is in-use, for example. And of course cheaper enclosures might take shortcuts such as being improperly ground, (though I've not seen that even on China specials, myself)

External Hard drives should be used for storage; not for active use, particularly for software installations.

First, regardless of what you tell the game or software, parts of it will need to be installed to the system drive. Many games will store in the registry where they are installed, so doing that means you now have to make sure the external shows up as the same drive letter, too. Saved Games typically will go into your Userprofile folder, so if you are low on disk space you should really be looking what you can delete from your system drive to save space. Also the "have two games running at the same time" comment confuses me, since having an external drive in no way facilitates that or makes it easier.

Basically there is nothing stopping you from using the HD the way you intend but it's unlikely the effect will be what you desire. I doubt "bad" things will result but the fact is if your system drive is low on space you should be looking to delete files from it, not install games/software to another drive. (paired with the additional house-keeping of making sure the external drive always shows up with the same drive letter)
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« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2012, 12:06:20 PM »


external hard drives most of the time aren't properly grounded which is just bad for computer equipment.

If you intend on using a hard drive on a daily matter, it should be inside the computer for best results.

These statements are both nonsense.
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« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2012, 12:15:46 PM »

These statements are both nonsense.

Yah, the most of the time should probably have been "some of the time" but other than that, the guy below me pretty much echoed my concerns in more detail.
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truenorth
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« Reply #10 on: January 28, 2012, 01:50:05 PM »

Just to clarify it was and isn't my intention to imply that externals don't present the possibilities of issues which in some cases can be unique to them as opposed to internals.However as with anything if you take the time to inform yourself as to what those issues may be and govern your use accordingly then my personal experience has been nothing but a positive one with externals (both self created from internals and store bought externals). I have a number of programs that i use on a variety of computers. I install them once and when needed carry them to the computer i wish to use it on rather than installing it on ALL of them. As i said never a problem yet in some cases over 5 years of use on some externals. Not to say it won't happen but then things happen.truenorth
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« Reply #11 on: January 28, 2012, 01:55:59 PM »

I have a number of programs that i use on a variety of computers. I install them once and when needed carry them to the computer i wish to use it on rather than installing it on ALL of them. As i said never a problem yet in some cases over 5 years of use on some externals.

These must be examples of portable programs that do not require installation in the host computer's program files folder, which do not create registry entries, install DLL files, etc.


Quote
Not to say it won't happen but then things happen.truenorth

???

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« Reply #12 on: January 28, 2012, 02:12:32 PM »

S.T. Wouldn't want you to be confused.So i will break down the portion of my post that seems to be confusing you."Not to say it won't happen "= even though i relate up to now that i have had NO problems i acknowledge that problems can/might occur. The second part"but then things happen"=loosely explained as little in life is guarantied so therefore things can happen to alter an expected outcome.Hope that shines some light on my meaning. ;) truenorth
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« Reply #13 on: January 28, 2012, 02:16:24 PM »

The second part"but then things happen"=loosely explained as little in life is guarantied so therefore things can happen to alter an expected outcome.Hope that shines some light on my meaning. ;) truenorth

I wasn't confused. I understood what you wrote. The question marks were intended to convey my surprise and dismay at such an un-rigorous attitude - "This is what I do, and it mostly works, but if it doesn't work for you, well... Hey! That's life!"



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« Reply #14 on: January 28, 2012, 02:18:35 PM »

I have a number of programs that i use on a variety of computers. I install them once and when needed carry them to the computer i wish to use it on rather than installing it on ALL of them.

As Salmon Trout points out Those applications are an exception rather than a rule. When  the installer does nothing more than copy files to the directory specified, then it works well. However, most applications deal with far more than just copying files to a single folder. Most non-trivial application installers usually do other tasks:

-Register COM components, or install .NET assemblies to the GAC.
-Register themselves with Windows Installer (for removal,modification, reinstall).
-Install Data to %appdata%\applicationname\, this could include things like images or default configuration files. Since the installer adds these, the application naturally get's confused if you run it and those folders aren't there (usually erroring out).
-Install Data to the registry. Often this combines with the former, so that the registry key might store the location of the install data, or version information, config information, etc. Again, since this is made by the installer it's usually pointless to bother writing code to make sure they exist, since if they don't the user is clearly using the application in an unsupported way and doesn't know what they are doing.

Naturally, installing the application to a removable drive and attempting to use that application on another PC will break loads of assumptions made by the application. Personally, if an application can be used in a "portable" manner, it doesn't need an installer anyway. As far as problems, it's not a matter of whether they can or might happen. It's a matter of when. How you managed to only do this with programs that don't do any of the above I don't know. Good luck doing this with Office or most games, though.

of course the application will still work from the machine it was installed to the external on in the above cases, it just won't work on other machines.
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truenorth
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« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2012, 02:43:42 PM »

S.T. Extremely liberal interpretation of my remarks. I didn't  say  "it mostly works," i said "my personal experience has been nothing but a positive one with externals" +"never a problem yet in some cases over 5 years of use on some externals." Both of which i suggest are far removed from the words that you are trying to ascribe to me with you interpretation. At the moment of contributing to this thread i am on a laptop with no external connected so i don't have access to reference what programs i have on an external. When i next plug one into a computer i will take a look. Generally they are programs i seldom use but like to have them (but not taking up storage on computer internal HDD's) . Sometimes for the instance of their utilization it is necessary to install them on any given computer from the .exe (or the install icon) file and then use it. But on completion i then uninstall it from said computer but NOT the portable and still available the next time of need.This would not be my practice for often used programs such as "office" truenorth
P.S. My curiosity had been peaked and i wondered what in fact i did have in the way of programs available on an external (found as well i should do some housecleaning) on the one i am looking at. It is a 250 gb (previously internal) now in a case about equally partitioned into a "G" and "H" drive. In the programs folder on "G' there are 22 programs there on "H" there are 34. Now that i have determined their existence i need to get rid of some (not for space requirements) simply never will use them again. I tend to monitor space on my internals and try to keep it under control but not so much on the externals.
« Last Edit: January 28, 2012, 03:09:48 PM by truenorth » IP logged
Allan
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« Reply #16 on: January 28, 2012, 02:54:13 PM »

Look, let's try to make this as simple as possible:

1) As far as the system is concerned you can use an external drive to do the same things as an internal drive.

2) External drives are not (in my opinion) created to be used on a daily basis. I only connect mine when needed. Having said that, see # 1 above.

3) If you need another drive to be used on a regular basis - or more space - I suggest you either add another internal drive or replace one of your internal drives with a larger one.
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« Reply #17 on: January 28, 2012, 05:32:19 PM »

External drives are not (in my opinion) created to be used on a daily basis. I only connect mine when needed. Having said that, see # 1 above.

My Seagate external USB hard drive has been running about 18 hours a day since July 2007 and I see no reason (so far) to worry about it. A shoddy badly cooled enclosure with a cheaply made wall wart PSU might be another matter. Given the right environment, a hard drive doesn't care where it is mounted. That's just my take anyhow.

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« Reply #18 on: January 28, 2012, 06:03:54 PM »

To add a bit more tho the fire.
Removable or external storage presents an issue for the OS. When the PC is turned on, an external device may not be ready. This creates a inflict if the strut up teaks include a reference(s)  to data or programs on the external device.

Also, having a PATA device run into a USB adapter adds another level of complexity to the system. This was documented my Microsoft. Presumably the issue was resolved some time ago. At that time a USB storage device, a PATA hard drive, could cause a stack overflow. The issue was not really the drive itself, but the use of the USB subsystem over a network. Not enough stack space.

The greatest danger of external devices is that they  get unplugged at the wrong time. But that should be self-evident.
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truenorth
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« Reply #19 on: January 28, 2012, 06:17:18 PM »

Geek=I guess you changed your mind about "i give up" ;D. I too after my last post had pretty well decided to do the same until your last post of 08:03 PM when i felt obliged to draw your attention to what i had said earlier " isn't my intention to imply that externals don't present the possibilities of issues which in some cases can be unique to them as opposed to internals.However as with anything if you take the time to inform yourself as to what those issues may be and govern your use accordingly ". I certainly see and appreciate the differences of opinions being presented on this subject. I hope it is serving to assist the O/P and not creating confusion.truenorth
P.S. Don't really know if it is the "best" procedure but i never turn on an external UNTIL the computer to which it is attached is fully done doing all it's stuff.
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« Reply #20 on: January 28, 2012, 08:00:45 PM »

Fair enough.
BTW, I use externals to backup my laptop. Because using the LAN for backup is really slow. Once in awhile I have a little trouble with the external drives.  I just live with it. But if I was a guru in a commercial enterprise, I would try to ban out-of-the-case storage devices unless they are screwed to the desk.  8)

To the OP. Go ahead. Use Ethe externals.

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ibfoxy1
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« Reply #21 on: January 28, 2012, 08:48:55 PM »

So, if I am following this, it is better to have an internal drive, but since I already have the external drive, go ahead and us it. 
Thanks for all your help.
You guys are wonderful!
I love this site    :-*
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truenorth
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« Reply #22 on: January 29, 2012, 05:29:14 AM »

You are very welcome.Hope to see more of you.truenorth
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Allan
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« Reply #23 on: January 29, 2012, 05:40:25 AM »

So, if I am following this, it is better to have an internal drive, but since I already have the external drive, go ahead and us it. 

In a nutshell, I think you've got it - at least that's my opinion and advice :)
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crazzyyyjoe
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« Reply #24 on: March 15, 2012, 09:35:45 PM »

I was wondering if you can use an external hard drive like a regular hard drive? What I want to do is play my games on an external hard drive. The hard drive on my computer is getting pretty full.  And I would like to keep more than one game going at a time.
I have a Dell XPS 630i, Windows XP Pro.

    Talk about bottle neck's depending in you USB port's 1.0,2.0,3.0.. your slowing down ...
If you want speed get PCI Raid card.. It is independant so free's you mobo..  :o
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« Reply #25 on: March 15, 2012, 10:36:11 PM »

These statements are both nonsense.
External HD needs to be in a proper case. From the OP, it is a drive he received as a gift, thus it is not a home brew gadget.

But there are others issues with external drives that have not been duly addressed here. If practical, the drive should be inside the case and on a SATA or PATA interface.

Another issue is when the drive is disconnected without doing the 'safely remove drive' request. A write error may corrupt part of the file system and start a chain of errors. Not very often, but even once is too much.

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