Computer Hope
Other => Other => Topic started by: Computer Hope Admin on February 12, 2007, 10:47:12 PM
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Pretty crazy news in my local town I thought I'd share. Shooting at a local mall, which ended up killing at least 5 people. I actually just ate there last week. Glad I didn't postpone it until today.
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=888784
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:o
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Sorry to hear that.
I don't want to hurt some1, but I think the allow to have a weapon for self defence-law isn't the best thing, if you see what a lot people in america do with it. It gives you situations like this and columbine...
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Blackberry, it isn't a law; it's part of our Constitution. It's one step above the "mere" law. And it's for more than self-defense; Americans have the right to bear arms. Period.
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America tends to have higher rates of gun homicides than the rest of the world, compared to both nations with strict or lax gun laws. If not for self-defence, I guess there must be some better reason to allow bear of arms not apparant to a non-American like me.
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Outlaw guns and then only outlaws will have guns...
Gun owners themselves are not part of the crime problem...criminals are.
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Wow, stuff like this happens all the time in Texas, especially around the Dallas Fort Worth Metroplex. It is a scary thought though :'(. That is a good point Patio, and I quote "Guns don't kill people, people kill people".
8-)fffreak
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I don't understand why ANYONE would ever be able to go out into the public and just start firing and killing another human being.
Let alone, killing someone you know.
It just doesnt make sense, especially when someone doesnt have a reason...
Glad you didn't postpone that trip, Nathan.
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Yeah, it's crazy. It's been all over the news (I'm from around there too). There are rumors at my High School about a shooting that's "supposed" to happen the day after Valentines. The school has been put in a semi-lockdown mode until it passes.
Crazy stuff going on...
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I guess there must be some better reason to allow bear of arms not apparant to a non-American like me.
Originally, the Second Amendment to the Constitution was written in response to the insane laws the King of England had. The Ten original Amendments were made to say not what the Government could do, but what it couldn't. Freedom of Speech, the Press, Religion and others were in the First Amendment. I can't remember the laws regarding guns offhand, but one of the inane laws was to severely restrict the ability citizens have to bear these arms.
There are still many uses for arms today. Self-defense is one. Hunting is another. Heck, even the thrill of shooting a gun is a valid reason (it's called target practice). Finally, in the extremely unlikely event that an invasion reaches our soil on land, and the Army isn't handy nearby (on their way, diverted to other areas, etc.), then we can form a Militia to defend our homeland.
I'm sure there are more reasons, but my brain is shutting down after a long day, so I can't think of anything else.
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Fair point, but I was also getting at the high rate of crime compared to other nations, even those that have lots of guns. Switzerland, for example, has a high rate of gun ownership among its male adult population, yet about a fith of the homocide rate to America. (Taking into account population size, before you say that). I guess then that it must be a culture/society issue...
You're right guns don't kill people, people do.. but maybe if they didn't have a gun it might not have happened? But there are lots of conflicting studies on this so I am prepared to accept gun ownership might not increase gun crime, although it is something I do not personally agree with.
As for this constitutional right to bear arms, this stems back to the old "colonial/frontier" days when there wasn't much of an organised police force, natives could attack or an invasion by a foreign power. Nowadays America is much more threatened by terrorists than an actual invasion, and terrorist would benefit most from such availability of guns, wouldn't you say?
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Yeah, it's crazy. It's been all over the news (I'm from around there too). There are rumors at my High School about a shooting that's "supposed" to happen the day after Valentines. The school has been put in a semi-lockdown mode until it passes.
Crazy stuff going on...
Excuse my language, but bloody *censored*! Is there a reason behind it? I thought my school was bad.
Chris
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Yeah, it's crazy. It's been all over the news (I'm from around there too). There are rumors at my High School about a shooting that's "supposed" to happen the day after Valentines. The school has been put in a semi-lockdown mode until it passes.
Crazy stuff going on...
Excuse my language, but bloody *censored*! Is there a reason behind it? I thought my school was bad.
Chris
Same.
At least no one at our school has actually died, although there have been several close calls.
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Outlaw guns and then only outlaws will have guns...
Gun owners themselves are not part of the crime problem...criminals are.
Giving some1 a gun, gives him the possibility to be a criminal..
Blackberry, it isn't a law; it's part of our Constitution. It's one step above the "mere" law. And it's for more than self-defense; Americans have the right to bear arms. Period.
Then you should explain me what an 18 year-old boy needs a weopon for if he is 18, does not live in a bear-populated-area or whatever. Selfdefence? I doubt
I don't understand why ANYONE would ever be able to go out into the public and just start firing and killing another human being.
Let alone, killing someone you know.
The agressive things in the media (reports of dially shootings), games (shoot on people to earn points) etc. Make some ppl do things like that.. sadly...
Did anyone watch bowling for columbine? In canada they have even more weopons for each person then in america (if you look to the population and the number of weapons). But do they kill eachother dealy? No! A few murders in a year. Well.. euh in Amerika...
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Another example is Switzerland, which also has universal gun ownership by military-aged males, and a low murder rate compared to the U.S. Contrary to the suggestions of pro-gun advocates, however, gun ownership in Switzerland is not universal; only 32 percent of the general population own guns. By comparison, this figure is 49 percent in the U.S. And Switzerland also has much stricter gun control laws. All military weapons (which are long-barreled) must be kept locked up, with their ammunition sealed, stored in a separate place, and strictly accounted for. Hence it is almost impossible to use these weapons for crime without detection. Handguns are also highly regulated. Even then Switzerland has both the highest handgun ownership and highest handgun murder rate in Europe.
Source (http://www.huppi.com/kangaroo/L-gunownership.htm)
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Saying that violent games makes people violent is rubbish. I play them all the time and I'm not mentally unballanced... well at least not violent. What's more likely the case is people who already have violent tendencies will seek out violent outlets such as games.
Maybe I live in some magical land, but my school never had anything like guns or knives or the like. Am I missing out?
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This left-blinded society / media :-/ will not tell the public the "real" story pertaining to this story. There is a Mosque very close to this mall and that the murderer was an immigrant Bosnian Muslim. His name is no other than the same of that Muslim conquerer years ago in the middle east. They are potraying this as Columbine-like but its a hate crime/ terrorist hit. Though he acted alone. Where's Jack Bauer when you need him? Way to go cop!!
Police identify gunman as 18-year-old Bosnian
By Linda Thomson
Deseret Morning News
Police Tuesday identified the gunman accused in Monday night's Trolley Square shooting as [highlight]Sulejman Talovic[/highlight], an 18-year-old Bosnian refugee who lived in Salt Lake City.
Salt Lake City Police Chief Chris Burbank said Talovic drove his car to the mall, parked in the west parking terrace and encountered two people who he shot before entering the mall.
There, he encountered a female who also was shot right away, then went into a gift shop where there were five people, all of whom the young man shot. Moving through the mall, the gunman tried to shoot others, Burbank said. The chief said he could not say now how many shots were involved in the entire episode.
http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,660195221,00.html
[highlight]Dr. Michael Savage[/highlight] was the only public figure to release this info last night*.
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There was someone on the news 3 days ago, He was 17 and he got into a fight. When he went home, his mom conforted him and everything then she gave him a gun and said, "go take care of it". Which I was surprised to hear a kids mom would give a kid a gun. And he did just that, he shot and killed his bully. His mom now faces 1st degree murder and he faces 3rd degree murder. Don't know how that happened because the kid knew what he was doing. He did this in school. Scary thought :'(.
8-)fffreak
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Saying that violent games makes people violent is rubbish. I play them all the time and I'm not mentally unballanced... well at least not violent. What's more likely the case is people who already have violent tendencies will seek out violent outlets such as games.
Maybe I live in some magical land, but my school never had anything like guns or knives or the like. Am I missing out?
You know, I find that Mario Kart makes me more violent than Grand Theft Auto (I don't own either -- friend does). After about 20 minutes of trying to handle that stupid N64 controller, I want to bash the TV with my controller.
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Saying that violent games makes people violent is rubbish. I play them all the time and I'm not mentally unballanced... well at least not violent. What's more likely the case is people who already have violent tendencies will seek out violent outlets such as games.
Maybe I live in some magical land, but my school never had anything like guns or knives or the like. Am I missing out?
I did NOT say, a violent game makes EVERY people violent. Only a few ones. And those few ones are enough to take the lifes of a lot of people
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Saying that violent games makes people violent is rubbish. I play them all the time and I'm not mentally unballanced... well at least not violent. What's more likely the case is people who already have violent tendencies will seek out violent outlets such as games.
Maybe I live in some magical land, but my school never had anything like guns or knives or the like. Am I missing out?
You know, I find that Mario Kart makes me more violent than Grand Theft Auto (I don't own either -- friend does). After about 20 minutes of trying to handle that stupid N64 controller, I want to bash the TV with my controller.
COL.
I find that my PC makes me more violent than any game, when it's playing me up.
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You are how you were raised....
Nuff said.
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COL.
I find that my PC makes me more violent than any game, when it's playing me up.
So it's Microsoft's fault then ::)
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Saying that violent games makes people violent is rubbish. I play them all the time and I'm not mentally unballanced... well at least not violent. What's more likely the case is people who already have violent tendencies will seek out violent outlets such as games.
Maybe I live in some magical land, but my school never had anything like guns or knives or the like. Am I missing out?
I did NOT say, a violent game makes EVERY people violent. Only a few ones. And those few ones are enough to take the lifes of a lot of people
Yea, i dotn know if you guys remeber but a while ago there was that game called Manhunt that was banned. That was because a lad dies because his mate practiced a move he saw on taht game by using a claw hammer.
Pretty grusome stuff.
Chris
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COL.
I find that my PC makes me more violent than any game, when it's playing me up.
So it's Microsoft's fault then ::)
Sometimes.
It depends whose product is playing me up at that point.
it may be Microsoft, it may be Evesham, it may be any of the countless other manufacturers I have bought things form and whose products have, at one time or another, struck a note of annoyance from the delicate harp of my feelings.
My my, I'm positively waxing lyrical today . . . what's wrong with me?
Edit: yeah, I remember Manhunt, Chris.
It was blamed for a load of murders and injuries, when it was either the kid's or the parents' fault - it was an 18, and the kids were way less than that.
If the parents knew about all the violence, why let their underage child buy the game? Or buy it for them?
I don't feel that there is one factor to blame for all the violence, it's a combination of things.
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You are how you were raised....
Nuff said.
I'll repeat. Blame can be conviently placed anywhere but the fact remains...
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Saying that violent games makes people violent is rubbish. I play them all the time and I'm not mentally unballanced... well at least not violent. What's more likely the case is people who already have violent tendencies will seek out violent outlets such as games.
Maybe I live in some magical land, but my school never had anything like guns or knives or the like. Am I missing out?
I did NOT say, a violent game makes EVERY people violent. Only a few ones. And those few ones are enough to take the lifes of a lot of people
Yea, i dotn know if you guys remeber but a while ago there was that game called Manhunt that was banned. That was because a lad dies because his mate practiced a move he saw on taht game by using a claw hammer.
Pretty grusome stuff.
Chris
I have manhunt, got it when it first came out. It is a pretty gruesome game.
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I agree Callum. It's 18 for a reason.
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fffreak, I realised why its 3 F's!!!!
Final
Fantasy
Freak
Anyway back to the subject. The age certifications are rediculous!!
I went into HMV the other day with my mates, tried to buy the 'Die Hard' trilogy box set, and the guy goes 'I'm sorry but your not 18, i cant let you have this'. Fair enough im not 18. But what really doesnt make ANY sence is that he then told me that if i brought in one of my parents or someone i knew who was 18 and they bought it for me i could have it. But that just defeats the whole point of a Cert rating, because im still going to watch it. All i did was go to one of my mates whos got a fake ID and let him buy it for me and the guy didnt mind at all eventhough i was stood wth him. If im honest i think theyre a complete waste of time because if i cant get one for whatever reason, all i have to do is 'aquire' a copy over the itnernet ;)
Chris
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I tend to think they make no sense either, I am a regular at my local GameStop, so now they don't even ask for me to bring a parent because, everytime they did, I just brought my dad in with me. It is ridicule. In 30 more days I will be 18, so now no electronic store can say anything. YES!! ;D
By the way, I'm surprised you just now noticed my name chriscool9.
8-)fffreak
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The ratings where I live aren't actually enforced, it's just a guide more than anything. :)
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In my area they only thing they really ask Age for is at the movie theaters, but the one occasion they do, they'd believe you if you said you where 18.
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Well,I read all the responses and with all the crazy
people out there in LaLa-Land...I sure am glad I have
the right to bear arms.
Most of the killing in the United States is drug related.
When people get on drugs they lose their souls.
They no longer feel love,or compassion for others.
They are dangerous and yet they are God's children.
My country has been robbing the tax payers for the
last 35 years and the drugs get worse.I don't really
believe my government wants to stop them.
Sorry folks! You got me on a tangent......SNAP! I'm Back.
Who's your buddy? [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
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Sorry it took so long to respond. Haven't been on here for awhile.
The thing going on at my school hasn't really changed much. We are still in a lockdown mode (IE: All the doors are locked at all times. If you are late to class you have to knock and wait for some one to open it. If you leave class during the class period you need to be "escorted" to where ever it is that you are going.)
Hopefully this will change. It's really starting to get annoying.
I'll keep you informed if you guys would like...
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If you don't, we'll think you're dead... :o
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Sorry it took so long to respond. Haven't been on here for awhile.
The thing going on at my school hasn't really changed much. We are still in a lockdown mode (IE: All the doors are locked at all times. If you are late to class you have to knock and wait for some one to open it. If you leave class during the class period you need to be "escorted" to where ever it is that you are going.)
Hopefully this will change. It's really starting to get annoying.
I'll keep you informed if you guys would like...
That's insane.
I can't believe it's really that bad.
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Wow!I always thought the Mormons were a
peaceful people........Who knows? :-?
Y'all Drink!Drink Plenty Of It!
BwaHaHaHa!------------>SNAP!
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Wha...?
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Who knows?
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I'm glad I was brought up in some "backward" farm area nobody's heard of before. It seems a lot safer, to say the least. In fact I never want to live in a big city. Some of the things one hears about London...
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Indeed.
London's a pretty bad place, I've only been there a few times and that's more than enough.
It's bad enough in Derby, and that's not particularly big.
As soon as I can, I'm out of here.
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My city has a population of about 1,400. Even in our town, we got a "you will all die 10-10-05" message last year. We were pretty badly locked down that day and the day after that. No-one did anything, though.
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We had somebody call somebody else a name once, but that was it.
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Well...nothing happened (big surprise eh?). We are still in a state of lockdown. Probably just for the rest of the week though.
In my Student Government class the teacher said that some kids are getting labeled 'the shooter' and what not and it's causing them some social/emotional problems. Which blows because this is a dumb reason for crap like this to happen.
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Hmm
I grew up on a farm, violentless (except for our shotguns)
Moved to the city, more violence (450 in graduating class)
Moved out in the middle of nowhere, nothing at all.... (around 35 people in my graduating class)
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Hmm
I grew up on a farm, violentless (except for our shotguns)
Moved to the city, more violence [highlight](450 in graduating class)[/highlight]
Moved out in the middle of nowhere, nothing at all.... (around 35 people in my graduating class)
450 what? Shootings? :o
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No, students. ;)
8-)fffreak
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Hmm
I grew up on a farm, violentless (except for our shotguns)
Moved to the city, more violence [highlight](450 in graduating class)[/highlight]
Moved out in the middle of nowhere, nothing at all.... (around 35 people in my graduating class)
450 what? Shootings? :o
My gosh, no. That would have been all over the news.
We didnt have shootings, but there was a previous time when (I read this in an archive online paper) that there was some sort of threat. The school has been closed a few times from threats, in fact, they once had us evacuate the school all the sudden out of the middle of nowhere, they told us that it was "just a test of the security system" and nothing more, but how would the principal picking up the phone and dialing the PA system and saying "Please evacuate the building" have to do with the schools security system?
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Obviously, it doesn't. ;)
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A question, on which age do you guys think people should be allowed to buy a gun. Who should be able and who shouldn't and why? Should there be a law if you have a gun, it should be on a safe place (for example a safe) so children wouldn't be able to grab it and shoot with it...
And most important, why? should you be able to have a weopon
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I think 16 is a good age. By then, they should be old enough to understand the reasons behind gun safety, the consequences of illegally using it, and ideally responsible enough to be "good" with guns. It'd be nice, though, if each person had to go through gun safety training before obtaining their first firearm. It'll cut down on accidental deaths.
Why own a gun? Rifles and Shotguns are good for hunting. (As are the pistols, to an extent - what better to take down a charging bear than an automatic .357 Magnum? 5 or 6 shots from that should bring him down.) Outside of hunting, pistols are good for self-defense. Gangs are prevalent in large-cities' poor areas.
Finally, on those nice sunny days, there's something to be said for killing an afternoon at the Target Range. :)
(For the record: I don't have a more powerful gun than a BB gun. It's my compact bow that can do real damage. :D)
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Pretty crazy news in my local town I thought I'd share. Shooting at a local mall, which ended up killing at least 5 people. I actually just ate there last week. Glad I didn't postpone it until today.
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=888784
note to self. buy a USP .45 handgun after my 18th birthday.. if nothing else, i'll at least blow off a limb.
EDIT: dilbert, if i have a bear charging at me, i'd rather take him down in one shot. the same goes for a mad man with a gun. a good twelve guage shotgun slug will do that. (not shell, a slug, big difference, you shoot buckshot at it, and it will just get really #*%&ing mad and probably charge faster, same goes for the .357)
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I think 16 is too young. My sister was riding the bus and an air rifle was shot through the window and just missed her, probably fired by the unruley youths. As to gangs being pervailant in certain areas, citizens should be able to rely on the police to keep law and order rather than go about taking the law into their own hands. What kind of country thinks that's an acceptable reason?
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I think 16 is too young. My sister was riding the bus and an air rifle was shot through the window and just missed her, probably fired by the unruley youths. As to gangs being pervailant in certain areas, citizens should be able to rely on the police to keep law and order rather than go about taking the law into their own hands. What kind of country thinks that's an acceptable reason?
anyone who will fire any weapon at a person, or animal, without it being in self defence, or a species that is in season, needs to be shot themselves. someone shot my dog a while back with birdshot, personally, whoever did it had better not attempt to do it again if i am around, or they will be the one that needs a doctor.. same thing happened to my neighbors dog a while back. its annoying how people are so careless these days. i'd just like to put all of the idiots like the one that shot my dog on a island in the middle of the ocean.
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I think it should be 21 years and up to own a gun.
Why?
Though a 16 year old can think of the consequences, and certainly know every wrong aspect, they are not always 100% likely to take it seriously. Especially since they will most likely not be sent to jail for shooting one person, since they are under the age of 18.
Then again, why not just have it at the age of 18? People are mature at that age, right? Not always. In my opinion, for a person to reach their full maturity level, and learn enough about life, they need to be 21. At 18, not everyone has the responsibility level they need yet.
But then again, there are some people who are considerably responsible for their age, and could have owned a gun at age 13 and done quite well with it.
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Theres no such thing as "Gun Safety" the only safety is the responisiblity of the user of the gun. which, is not a good thing now-a-days...
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anyone who will fire any weapon at a person, or animal, without it being in self defence, or a species that is in season, needs to be shot themselves.
Somewhat of a contradiction. Well technically I suppose it leads to an infinate chain of shootings.......
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anyone who will fire any weapon at a person, or animal, without it being in self defence, or a species that is in season, needs to be shot themselves.
Somewhat of a contradiction. Well technically I suppose it leads to an infinate chain of shootings.......
chain reactions can be funny at times..
EDIT: but not in the game Doom, in the level Barrels O' Fun..
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I think it should be 21 years and up to own a gun.
Why?
Though a 16 year old can think of the consequences, and certainly know every wrong aspect, they are not always 100% likely to take it seriously. Especially since they will most likely not be sent to jail for shooting one person, since they are under the age of 18.
Then again, why not just have it at the age of 18? People are mature at that age, right? Not always. In my opinion, for a person to reach their full maturity level, and learn enough about life, they need to be 21. At 18, not everyone has the responsibility level they need yet.
But then again, there are some people who are considerably responsible for their age, and could have owned a gun at age 13 and done quite well with it.
21-That should also go for joining the Armed Forces,voting -ETC..
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How about it goes:
As soon as you have moved out of your parents house
lol
That sounds like a good one, for guns, voting, army, and everything else.
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How about it goes:
As soon as you have moved out of your parents house
lol
That sounds like a good one, for guns, voting, army, and everything else.
Always an exception though--->DRIVERS LICENSE!
Never take that from a good teenager. [smiley=thumbsup.gif]
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Speaking of which, I need to start reading that ##$% drivers book since I am turning 16 soon, and havent passed the permit test due to a clutter of events.
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Speaking of which, I need to start reading that ##$% drivers book since I am turning 16 soon, and havent passed the permit test due to a clutter of events.
Dude, r u yet allowed to drive in a car @ the age of 16?!. In Belgium it's the age of 18.. (but, you can start driving @ the age of 16 and 9 months - I know, weird, those 9 months.. - with a supervisor..
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Yes, in America, you are allowed to drive at the age of 16, as long as you have drivers ed, or have your parent teach you. You can get a permit at the age of 15 then you have to hold it for 6 months, before you can get your license.
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Yes, in America, you are allowed to drive at the age of 16, as long as you have drivers ed, or have your parent teach you. You can get a permit at the age of 15 then you have to hold it for 6 months, before you can get your license.
I got my license just before they changed that law ;D. My 6 months just passed so now I can legally drive with people other than my family in the car, which is nice for dates :P.
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How about it goes:
As soon as you have moved out of your parents house
lol
That sounds like a good one, for guns, voting, army, and everything else.
What? If you leave your parents' house young that's probably less of a reason to be allowed a gun.