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Author Topic: how to add hot spare into raid 5  (Read 42948 times)

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sandy6633

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    how to add hot spare into raid 5
    « on: April 22, 2010, 07:24:43 AM »
    Hi,
     we have got raid 5 configured on the win server 2003. its HP proliant dl 585, we have got 6 sas hdd, we are running short of space and we need to add hot spare into the raid5 how do i do that. can anyone suggest me bout this please.

    thanks

    Spoiler



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    Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
    « Reply #1 on: April 23, 2010, 05:08:44 AM »
    If I remember right the controller on that model can't handle expanding the drive array.

    If thats true then to add another drive you will need to do a full backup and then add the drive and rebuild the raid 5 set and format it. Then do a full restore of your data to the new drive.

    Whenever I watch TV and I see those poor starving kids all over the world, I can't help but cry. I mean I would love to be skinny like that, but not with all those flies and death and stuff." - Mariah Carey, Pop Singer

    michaewlewis



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    Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
    « Reply #2 on: April 23, 2010, 09:24:38 AM »
    It shouldn't affect anything to just add a hot spare. The whole idea of a hot spare is that is just sits there waiting for a drive to fail and then spins up to replace the failed one.
    Depending on your needs (maybe you could give more detail), I would recommend getting all new (bigger) drives and creating a new array with the same amount of disks. The more disks you have in an array, the more likely a hard drive failure is. (Check out http://www.baarf.com)

    Geek-9pm


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    Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
    « Reply #3 on: April 23, 2010, 03:25:39 PM »
    Spoiler is right.

    michaewlewis



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    Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
    « Reply #4 on: April 23, 2010, 04:22:27 PM »
    We both are right.

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    Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
    « Reply #5 on: April 23, 2010, 10:57:27 PM »
    We both are right.
    Let's not argue.
    He has a very high in server and he wants to add more disk drive space. The hot-swap feature he has is only for a merger to use in case of a failure or routine maintenance.
    To make a significant increase in the amount of space he has, it means doing a complete backup of the whole system, installing larger drives, and then bringing the whole system back up from a backup.
    The key point was that he did not want to shut the thing down. He was hoping the hot-swap feature could be used as a method for scaling up the drive capacity.
    In my opinion, which does not count for much in this case, he must get real  help from another company to establish a virtual server on somebody else's established plant. Port to the virtual server as a background task. Then at some point in time switch everything to the virtual server. I have no idea how this is done. But people do it. I believe there has to be at least some downtime during the process. Even so, renting a virtual server for say a couple of weeks is still cheaper than going out and buying another server to bring online. Those servers are very, very expensive.

    sandy6633

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      Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
      « Reply #6 on: April 26, 2010, 07:47:47 AM »
      I agree with all those things but cant i add the hot spare without taking the backup and again doing a restore.. because server is online... i just need to add that hot spare into the array thats it... and i will be done with it..

      michaewlewis



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      Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
      « Reply #7 on: April 26, 2010, 11:28:51 AM »
      I agree with all those things but cant i add the hot spare without taking the backup and again doing a restore.. because server is online... i just need to add that hot spare into the array that's it... and i will be done with it..

      Let's make sure we know what you are wanting. You say you want to add a drive to be a hot spare, but you also want more storage. They don't mean the same thing.

      A hot spare drive will not give you more storage, it only adds an amount of redundancy in the case of a failed hard drive. If this is what you want, then it is a very simple task and would not require a backup. I would still recommend a backup of the server, though, just in case something goes wrong with the addition.

      If you want the extra hard drive to provide more storage, then you will need to do the backup and restore method described by spoiler. I would recommend using Symantec Backup Exec System Recovery for this procedure since you can bring your down time to less than an hour or two. If you need to have zero downtime, you can copy the backup to a temporary workstation setup or a virtual machine for the duration of the server restore.

      sandy6633

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        Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
        « Reply #8 on: April 26, 2010, 11:03:34 PM »
        Hello, I already have a hot spare, its simply a waste HDD as of now. So its better i add that to Array so that we get more space.


        michaewlewis



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        Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
        « Reply #9 on: April 27, 2010, 03:01:35 PM »
        Okay. Thanks for clarifying. It would be even better to add another hard drive and keep your hot spare. Redundancy isn't a waste when it comes to critical data.

        If you need the extra space, do a backup of all your system and all your files and rebuild the array to take advantage of the new hard drive. To rebuild the array, reboot the server and watch the screen for a hotkey to press to load the raid management console during post. In the console, delete the array and remove the spare hard drive from hotspare status. After that, create a new raid5 array with the hard drives you want.
        When you have the array configuration finished, reboot again and reload the operating system and files.

        sandy6633

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          Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
          « Reply #10 on: April 27, 2010, 10:33:46 PM »
          Thanks a lot. I think i have to follow this.

          I have heard that we can add existing hot spare into array when server is live. it happens when we r using intel raid controller card.

          Sid



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            Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
            « Reply #11 on: April 28, 2010, 02:47:54 AM »
            Thanks a lot. I think i have to follow this.

            I have heard that we can add existing hot spare into array when server is live. it happens when we r using intel raid controller card.

            I think you're confused as to what a "hot spare" is.

            A hot spare is a spare drive that remains unused until one of the drives in the raid array fails.

            I think what you want to do is expand your raid array.  These two actions are not the same, and this is not possible with the equiptment you have.

            If you cannot take the server offline long enough to create a NEW raid array including the extra drive you are currently using as a hot spare, then I would look into the possibility of including a Network Attached Storage (NAS) solution to your network, assuming space cannot be cleared by removing existing data.

            killerb255



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              Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
              « Reply #12 on: May 26, 2010, 10:45:15 AM »
              Yep, just as Sid said.

              Hot spare = Holy ****!  A drive failed!  Quick, use the spare!  Use the spare!

              Hot spare is NOT "We need more space, add it in!"

              Your options are:

              A) As Sid say, get a NAS and use that for extra space.
              B) Add another RAID array (and another RAID controller if need be) and use that for extra space.
              C) Backup the data, put new drives in place, and restore the data.

              Option A is far less intrusive on your end-users.  Option B requires some downtime (an after-hours job, most likely).  Option C requires A LOT of downtime (again, after-business hours) and some precision to pull off correctly.

              Easiest way to pull off Option C is to clone the partitions on the RAID array to a network share or a large enough hard drive to hold it all.  Once they're cloned, swap your drives, recreate your array, and then push the clone back to the new array.  To do this, you'll need:
              a) Windows PE 3.0: http://www.computerhope.com/forum/index.php/topic,87312.0.html
              b) Symantec Ghost Solution Suite 2.5 (and, in particular, Ghost32.exe and Ghostexp.exe from it)
              c) 32-bit Windows 7 RAID drivers for your RAID controller (yes, Windows 7, since PE 3.0 is based on it).
              d) New drives (obviously)

              1) Boot into PE 3.0, and if you injected the RAID controller drivers properly (4-Drivers.bat should help you with this) and copied Ghost32.exe to the CD or the X: drive (the RAM drive for PE), then PE will see the array.

              2) Type ghost32.exe at the PE command prompt and then press Enter.  Ghost will launch. 

              3) Select Local -> Partition -> To Image -> select where you want to save the image.  Call the image something that makes it easy to identify (like C-partition.gho or something).  Let it clone.

              4) Repeat #3 for any other partitions on your RAID array if necessary.  If you only had one partition, skip this step.

              5) Use another computer with ghostexp.exe (Ghost Explorer) on it and make ABSOLUTE CERTAIN your images have all your data!!!!.  Alternatively, if you injected ghostexp.exe into your PE disc, you can launch it from PE and check your images' integrity.

              6) Turn off your server and switch out your old drives for bigger ones.

              7) Power back on, and create your RAID array using whatever utilities available for your controller.  You probably won't be able to make an array larger than 1.7 TB (and I highly suggest you don't even try--otherwise, this whole operation will go bust and you'll be a very angry network administrator). 

              8) Boot back into Windows PE 3.0.

              9) Type in diskpart at the command prompt. 

              10) Type list disk and press Enter to see what's available. 

              11) Type select disk 0 (or whatever disk number represents your RAID array) and press Enter. 

              12) Type create partition primary size=xxxxx (fill in the X's with whatever size you want the first partition to be in MB) and press Enter.  If you only had one partition on your old array, then leave off size=xxxxx--this will force the partition to consume the remaining space on the array.

              13) Type active to set that as the active partition.  Press Enter.

              14) Type assign letter c to assign letter C to that partition.  Press Enter.  If drive letter C is not available, then you may have to change the drive letter of your CD-ROM drive or any other drives attached first.

              15) Type format fs=ntfs quick to format the partition using NTFS and to do it quickly (you don't want to wait all day).  Press Enter.

              16) If you had a second partition on your old array, type create partition primary size=xxxxx again to create a second partition if necessary.  If all you are going to have is two partitions, then simply leave off the size=xxxxx part and the partition will use up the rest of the available space.  Press Enter.

              17) Repeat Steps 14 and 15 for your second partition, substituting the appropriate drive letter for your second partition (i.e.: use assign letter d, for example).

              18) If you have additional partitions, repeat Steps 16 and 17, making appropriate substitutions.

              19) Type exit to get out of DISKPART.

              20) Fire up ghost32.exe again, and this time, Local -> Partition -> From Image.  Select where you saved the image from your old array's first partition.

              21) Select the first partition you created on your new array.  Click OK when asked to overwrite the partition.

              22) Repeat Steps 20-21 for your other partitions, if any.

              23) When finished, type exit to get out of PE, remove the CD, and restart your server.  If all goes well, your server will boot back up in the exact state that it was in plus significantly more disk space on your partitions!  You will have to reboot after you log in the first time, as the New Hardware Wizard will detect the new drives and will want to restart your server, so don't give everyone the green light to get back in yet!

              24) After reboot, test out your server, and pat yourself on the back for a job well done!
              Quote from: talontromper
              Part of the problem is most people don't generally deal with computer problems. So for most they think that close enough is good enough.

              Geek-9pm


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              Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
              « Reply #13 on: May 26, 2010, 10:11:56 PM »
              killerb255,
              What you say is technically correct.
              The real issue is that the OP is a rookie and he has no idea of what a RAID 5 array is.

              He does not understand that you have to have a lot of downtime to do a major overhaul of a RAID array.

              The RAID array exists to give the system the performance and security he needs. It is not just a bunch of Hard Drives. It is a fine-tuned machine. Like a race car. You don't replace just one tire on a race car to give it more speed. You don't replace one drive on a RAID-5 to give it more space.

              Yes, there are new technologies beyond RAID 5. But let's not confuse the OP with that. He seems to be determined to find a cheap way to increase storage space.  Can not be done on the cheap.

              IMO he best short term choice is to get help from professionals who can rent him a server the will suit his present needs while he seeks a long term solution withing his budget.

              Here is one of many power hosting sites.
              http://www.rackspace.com/
              They have an on-line chat.

              Also try http://1and1.com

              In any case, he has to talk to a major host directly and make them understand his specific needs. Big RAID servers carry a premium price.


              BC_Programmer


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              Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
              « Reply #14 on: May 27, 2010, 04:07:37 AM »
              Quote
              It is not just a bunch of Hard Drives.

              Redundant Array of (Independent|Inexpensive) Disks.

              Sounds like a bunch of hard drives to me.
              I was trying to dereference Null Pointers before it was cool.

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              Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
              « Reply #15 on: May 27, 2010, 11:29:46 AM »
              Redundant Array of (Independent|Inexpensive) Disks.

              Sounds like a bunch of hard drives to me.
              They are physically independent. But they must work together to give the system its performance goals.

              A bunch of flowers and a floral arrangement are not the same
              A Drive Array is not a bunch of drives.

              Here is a suggested reference about a actual product.
              Setting up the 2.5 TB hot-swap array
              Perhaps this article will help the OP understand you can not increase the storage capacity by upgrading just one drive in a system based mostly on hardware.

              [Yes, you can do 3 physical drives a a virtual 5 drive array in software.Tthat is not the case here.]

              heavyend81

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              Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
              « Reply #16 on: March 05, 2011, 06:49:59 PM »
              I am running Server 2008 Ent and have a Raid 5 setup with 5 x 2tb drives and wish to add a 6th drive also of the same make and capacity to use as a hot spare. Can someone please explain how I do this in Server 2008.  I dont want extra space and I understand what a hot spare is but can't find how to implement it in WHS 2008.



              Hi,
               we have got raid 5 configured on the win server 2003. its HP proliant dl 585, we have got 6 sas hdd, we are running short of space and we need to add hot spare into the raid5 how do i do that. can anyone suggest me bout this please.

              thanks

              Sid



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                Re: how to add hot spare into raid 5
                « Reply #17 on: March 06, 2011, 08:44:55 AM »
                I am running Server 2008 Ent and have a Raid 5 setup with 5 x 2tb drives and wish to add a 6th drive also of the same make and capacity to use as a hot spare. Can someone please explain how I do this in Server 2008.  I dont want extra space and I understand what a hot spare is but can't find how to implement it in WHS 2008.

                Ok, 1) Start your own thread.  2) RAID 5 isn't a Windows thing, it's completely un-related.  Windows doesn't really "do" RAID.  3) You'll probably need to recreate the container, which means wiping the current config, which means a backup & restore will be required.  That is, unless the RAID hardware you're using supports adding disks to a RAID 5, which is what you're doing if you're adding a hot spare, which I doubt.  If you just want it as a spare, then you have no problems, but you will have to manually replace the failed drive, in it's slot, with the working one.  Also, you need to check that your RAID hardware supports hot spares.  Link to the new post and I'll follow it.