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Author Topic: Firefox 6, Bet 1 Available  (Read 8496 times)

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Transfusion



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Re: Firefox 6, Bet 1 Available
« Reply #15 on: July 27, 2011, 09:51:01 AM »
Tit for tat, I guess. Allow Microsoft to have a monopoly on OSes, but restrict its share in other markets. Make another move to dethrone Google from being the search engine dominator by shaking off its funding. AMD selling processors at competitive prices so it will have a guaranteed market share. The human rat race must go on.



Open source and non-profit. The creative commons license says it all.
Linux distro developers just sell their ideas to massive companies, etc. etc.
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patio

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Re: Firefox 6, Bet 1 Available
« Reply #16 on: July 27, 2011, 09:57:09 AM »
I think you're confused here...
" Anyone who goes to a psychiatrist should have his head examined. "

Salmon Trout

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Re: Firefox 6, Bet 1 Available
« Reply #17 on: July 27, 2011, 10:02:53 AM »
I think you're confused here...

That is one way of putting it.


Transfusion



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Re: Firefox 6, Bet 1 Available
« Reply #18 on: July 27, 2011, 10:03:47 AM »
http://www.mozilla.org/about/
About Mozilla


Mozilla is a global non-profit dedicated to putting you in control of your online experience and shaping the future of the Web for the public good. When you use Firefox, you're supporting that mission and making the Web better for everyone!

I do not think I am confused.
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BC_Programmer


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Re: Firefox 6, Bet 1 Available
« Reply #19 on: July 27, 2011, 10:06:45 AM »
Tit for tat, I guess. Allow Microsoft to have a monopoly on OSes, but restrict its share in other markets. Make another move to dethrone Google from being the search engine dominator by shaking off its funding. AMD selling processors at competitive prices so it will have a guaranteed market share. The human rat race must go on.
What are you even talking about? For one thing, Open Source is in no way equivalent to non-profit. non-profit would be Richard Stallmans Idealistic world where nobody get's paid to actually create the software, which is so crappy that you have to pay consultants to figure out how to do anything useful with it. Open Source just means that a product has it's source available. It in no way means the product is free- for example, Doom and Quake are Both Open Source, but they aren't free, as are a vast number of other products.

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Open source and non-profit. The creative commons license says it all.

Creative  Commons is an alternative the the ironically restrictive CopyLeft of GPL. Creative Commons is quite literally more Open than many other Open Source licenses, with the possible exception of the BSD/MIT license. The very reason that the various Creative Commons were created was because the GPL was inherently incompatible with any commercial license at all. This meant that in order for any GPL tool to get any use by companies or in the enterprise, a lot of that companies stuff would have to be GPL'd as well. Creative Commons is really quite similar to the BSD/MIT license, in that it isn't inherently malicious towards commercial software development.


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Linux distro developers just sell their ideas to massive companies, etc. etc.
No. a vast majority of Linux developers are in fact being paid to do that by their employers- companies like Red Hat or Novell, who manage their own distros, Canonical, which manages the Ubuntu distro- but most of them are employed in companies that are trying to actually do stuff with Linux, but can't, and have to actually add the required capabilities. Or, in some cases, they want to use some of the code in some way, but because of the GPL have to commit everything that results from changing that code back into the source tree (Microsoft).

I do not think I am confused.
I suppose you believe that Google will never do anything bad because it's in their slogan, too?

But that is redundant. Open Source and non-profit are still entirely separate. Whether Mozilla happens to be or claim to be non-profit is redundant- half of their ventures still require money and a good portion of that comes from google and donations from other companies. The only difference is they don't profit from their ventures. A lot of the contributions made to firefox, like Linux, are in fact done by developers paid to do it; by their respective companies, for a variety of reasons. Usually to fix bugs that they submitted a year before and still aren't fixed, so they say to F with it and assign one of their devs to work on that bugfix. Naturally this is only the case when that bug has a significant impact on the company, but this is a lot more common than one would expect.

I was trying to dereference Null Pointers before it was cool.

patio

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Re: Firefox 6, Bet 1 Available
« Reply #20 on: July 27, 2011, 10:52:13 AM »
A small but concise clarification on Mozilla provided for edification:::

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On August 3, 2005, the Mozilla Foundation launched a wholly owned subsidiary called the Mozilla Corporation to continue the development and delivery of Mozilla Firefox and Mozilla Thunderbird. The Mozilla Corporation takes responsibility for release planning, marketing and a range of distribution-related activities. It also handles relationships with businesses, many of which generate income. Unlike the Mozilla Foundation, the Mozilla Corporation is a taxable entity, which gives it much greater freedom in the revenue and business activities it can pursue. The majority of the revenues comes from Google, which is the default search engine on Mozilla Firefox.
" Anyone who goes to a psychiatrist should have his head examined. "

Transfusion



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Re: Firefox 6, Bet 1 Available
« Reply #21 on: July 27, 2011, 10:57:38 AM »
What are you even talking about? For one thing, Open Source is in no way equivalent to non-profit. non-profit would be Richard Stallmans Idealistic world where nobody get's paid to actually create the software, which is so crappy that you have to pay consultants to figure out how to do anything useful with it.
I am fully aware that Mozilla is a Corporation... as above, and that obviously, it would be competitive. No relation to its supporting the development of Firefox/open source software.
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Salmon Trout

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Re: Firefox 6, Bet 1 Available
« Reply #22 on: July 27, 2011, 11:06:12 AM »
Transfusion, even if your posts didn't already cast doubt upon your judgement and, er, cognitive skills, your signature certainly would.

BC_Programmer


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Re: Firefox 6, Bet 1 Available
« Reply #23 on: July 27, 2011, 11:24:36 AM »
I am fully aware that Mozilla is a Corporation...
Congratulations. I never stated you didn't, though.

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as above, and that obviously, it would be competitive.
Also not seeing the relevance to the passage you quoted from me to this.

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No relation to its supporting the development of Firefox/open source software.


you originally said "wouldn't the individual profits gained by marketing an open-source project be miniscule?"

Which, for one thing, makes no sense, because marketing <costs> money, it doesn't make it. Their funding comes from paid contracts with other companies (on the Mozilla Corporation side) and donations (on the  Mozilla foundation side). That funding makes them a profit.  Actually this is starting to sound a bit like a Ponzi scheme.
I was trying to dereference Null Pointers before it was cool.

Transfusion



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To Salmon Trout:
« Reply #24 on: July 27, 2011, 11:35:34 AM »

It's 1:17 AM here, I'm tired, and my signature is, well, my signature. 8)   I know, I sound stupid.


My cognitive abilities are judged by "Open source and non-profit. The creative commons license says it all." and "Tit for tat, I guess. Allow Microsoft to have a monopoly on OSes, but restrict its share in other markets. Make another move to dethrone Google from being the search engine dominator by shaking off its funding. AMD selling processors at competitive prices so it will have a guaranteed market share. The human rat race must go on."


On reading more about the CC license, I understand that the term non-profit is not applicable to all CC licensed software. I have not stated that Open Source is equal to non-profit in any way. I have stated that Mozilla Cooperation, competing with others, is detaching Firefox from Google for tactical reasons. Why else would they bite the hand that feeds them? As stated above: Google provides 85% of Mozilla's funding.


Mozilla CLAIMS to be non-profit and supports open source software.


On August 3, 2005, the Mozilla Foundation launched a wholly owned subsidiary called the Mozilla Corporation to continue the development and delivery of Mozilla Firefox and Mozilla Thunderbird. The Mozilla Corporation takes responsibility for release planning, marketing and a range of distribution-related activities. It also handles relationships with businesses, many of which generate income. Unlike the Mozilla Foundation, the Mozilla Corporation is a taxable entity, which gives it much greater freedom in the revenue and business activities it can pursue. The majority of the revenues comes from Google, which is the default search engine on Mozilla Firefox.[/size]

Mozilla naturally wants to gain relationships with more businesses, just like any reputable company would.


If all else fails, I'll avoid sleeping next to my wifi router to avoid further decline of my cognitive abilities.
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patio

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Re: Firefox 6, Bet 1 Available
« Reply #25 on: July 27, 2011, 11:45:37 AM »
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Mozilla CLAIMS to be non-profit and supports open source software.

Again your missing it...

Mozilla Foundation is non-profit...

Mozilla Corporation is not...

Hopes this clears things up...
" Anyone who goes to a psychiatrist should have his head examined. "

BC_Programmer


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Re: Firefox 6, Bet 1 Available
« Reply #26 on: July 27, 2011, 12:07:17 PM »
On reading more about the CC license, I understand that the term non-profit is not applicable to all CC licensed software.

Non-profit only applies for Freeware. Most licenses- Not even the GPL. Make no license requirements that the software not be sold, or distributed at cost.


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I have not stated that Open Source is equal to non-profit in any way.
what about "Open source and non-profit. The creative commons license says it all."


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I have stated that Mozilla Cooperation, competing with others, is detaching Firefox from Google for tactical reasons.

Except, it isn't. And there isn't really any good reason to speculate either way on whether the contract will be renewed when it expires in November 2011. And if it isn't renewed, it will probably be as a result of Google deciding they can do better with just chrome rather than FF. I don't see any tact in Mozilla cutting off 85=90% of their revenue stream.

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Mozilla CLAIMS to be non-profit and supports open source software.
Mozilla <foundation>. Non-profit doesn't mean it works with magic and rainbows, though. Money is still required to do anything.



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If all else fails, I'll avoid sleeping next to my wifi router to avoid further decline of my cognitive abilities.

 ;D
I was trying to dereference Null Pointers before it was cool.