Author Topic: In My Humble Opinion (open letter to dl65) (Read 8012 times)

Hopester Doofus · « **on:** July 29, 2006, 03:34:29 PM »

I'll start this with a smile.

And now my point:

With all due respect, dl (and you know I mean that), it's an abuse of your privileges for you to shut down the "Is This Appropriate?" topic we were discussing.

There's nothing wrong with getting sidetracked a little bit every now and again, and it isn't hurting anybody or detracting from the integrity of the site. It's one thread, and nobody is being forced to read it. And I don't see that other threads are suffering because of it.

In addition to being a help site, this forum is also a community, populated by acquaintances, friends and colleagues. We are interested in each other, and in each other's opinions on matters not just related to bits and bytes. If we can't be permitted to digress from time to time, with healthy discussion on non-computer related topics, then it loses a little appeal.

If ComputerHope ever becomes overrun by such threads, then I will wholeheartedly support pinching them off en masse. But this isn't the case today, and this action was unfair to the participants.

Hopester

soybean · « **Reply #1 on:** July 29, 2006, 04:06:11 PM »

I've seen some computing forums add sections to their forum specifically for non-computing discussions. It's something to consider.

GX1_Man · « **Reply #2 on:** July 29, 2006, 04:28:58 PM »

I think the Indians have it, too.

http://forums.techarena.in/

Dilbert · « **Reply #3 on:** July 29, 2006, 04:44:17 PM »

And I was just posting there in my free time. I hadn't even begun to warm up on the subject.

But then, the last thing I want to do is try to justify my faith based on science. For one, I can't; that is why they call it a faith. A faith would be synonimous (sp?) to a theory, which is basically saying "This is what I think based on XYZ and ABC". No religion holds up in court. Of course, if one were to scrutinize... oh, I dunno... the Theory of Evolution (and you can beat around the bush all you want with your "definition" of 'theory', it's not proven fact; just a note to my liberal geology teacher), there would be plently of holes as well that need to be explained if possible.

In summary: I try not to get involved with "Is religion real" debates since neither side has any proof (though both are always sure they do). I only participated in that thread to express opinion, not argue. Anyone who really wants to argue about that kind of thing can do that in PMs.

I really don't mind that the thread is closed (though I have to ask if it was truly necessary), since my involvement IMO was periphrial at best.

panboy · « **Reply #4 on:** July 29, 2006, 05:02:05 PM »

I also think DL65 has been Taking his privileges a little Too far, i dont see how you can mark a Topic in the other fourm as being off topic, when as far as i can see the other fourm is for just that , off topic posting

GX1_Man · « **Reply #5 on:** July 29, 2006, 06:30:03 PM »

Quote

my thoughts exactly... i mean, other means anything off topic or on topic is allowed, aslong as its not utter nonesense

There is a LOT of utter nonsense that is not deleted or closed. Perhaps it should be? Some people's post count would drop dramatically.

GX1_Man · « **Reply #6 on:** July 29, 2006, 07:05:31 PM »

That was one of those "If the shoe fits, wear it" responses.

Dead_reckon · « **Reply #7 on:** July 29, 2006, 07:08:10 PM »

not familiar with the term, but, were from two differant parts of the US, what do you expect?

GX1_Man · « **Reply #8 on:** July 29, 2006, 07:23:55 PM »

I think it has more to do with your age and exposure, rather than geographical location.

http://members.aol.com/MorelandC/HaveOriginsData.htm

dl65 · « **Reply #9 on:** July 29, 2006, 07:51:56 PM »

In response to the above comments .........
Let me start , by saying that this forum is called Computer Hope.Com, and it's purpose was and hopefully still is to provide assistance to those with problems and issues encountered when using their computers.
When the forum was setup , it was broken up into sections to provide specific areas to post the members issues ......but the one thing ,all the various boards have in common is that they all relate to computers. It has been suggested , that I overstepped my authority by closing that particular thread ...... as an example I quote , "I also think DL65 has been Taking his privileges a little Too far, i dont see how you can mark a Topic in the other fourm as being off topic, when as far as i can see the other fourm is for just that , off topic posting" ..... In response to this comment , I can only say , that the poster
has failed to realise that "OTHER" relates to other computer issues which do not fall into one of the other very clearly defined areas.
Before closing the topic , I reviewed all 4 pages of posts ...... and there is not so much as one word . let alone a phrase or a sentance relating to a computer.
If I have missed one , even a subminimal one , please let me know .
In closing , let me say that if some of you are perplexed at the thread being closed , I say to you , show me anything in the 4 page dialogue that directly refers to computers and I will immediately unlock the thread and issue a public appology to all the forum members.

dl65

infoseeker · « **Reply #10 on:** July 29, 2006, 09:43:56 PM »

and with all due respect, i received also comment in one of my "started thread"
[size=14][highlight]that this post is not related in this computer hope forum[/highlight][/size]

i understand that comment and respect it and for my 2 cents (opinion)

[size=16]Why the admin is not putting a section for "OFF TOPIC" so we can discuss freely what other things we want to share to others[/size]

:-? as i read this opinion so many times from other member :-?

infoseeker

Hopester Doofus · « **Reply #11 on:** July 29, 2006, 10:29:20 PM »

You're missing the point, friend. A lot of the members above have expressed a willingness for the Other category to be open to the occasional non-computer related topic of discussion. As this forum is driven by the membership, you should be amenable to that if it doesn't detract from the site.

In any event, this is a call better suited for Nathan, not yourself. You've overstepped.

GX1_Man · « **Reply #12 on:** July 29, 2006, 10:39:04 PM »

Without getting into the rightness or wrongness of the postings themselves, and with all due respect to all parties involved, when Nathan contacted me about being a mod his direct quote was:

"This would add no additional obligation or requirements on the forums simply give you the ability to remove / edit inappropriate posts. "

That was it. He did not specify what all "inappropriate" covered. When I queried him, the response was to use common sense rather than any specific guidelines.

johnchain · « **Reply #13 on:** July 29, 2006, 10:44:09 PM »

First of all....I said it was in an assembly language book....why else would I put it in a computer "other" forum?

But yeah, I'm okay with it being closed, it started taking time out of my day (It's a an exhilerating topic). I almost was late to my chess tournament today

But hey.........I got a topic with like 55 posts.....I'm proud of myself.

homer · « **Reply #14 on:** July 30, 2006, 01:27:26 AM »

im pretty sure anybody who started a highly controversial topic would get many posts...

infoseeker · « **Reply #15 on:** July 30, 2006, 02:24:52 AM »

Quote

You're missing the point, friend. A lot of the members above have expressed a willingness for the Other category to be open to the occasional non-computer related topic of discussion. As this forum is driven by the membership, you should be amenable to that if it doesn't detract from the site.
In any event, this is a call better suited for Nathan, not yourself. You've overstepped.

one thing for sure, im not missing the point Hipster Doofus
and im not overstepping anyone here
or maybe youre the one who did not get my points of view
thats why im asking why not putting a section for "OFF TOPIC" a non computer related topic section

[size=16]its only my opinion[/size], because as i said i experienced already here
i started a topic in"other" and someone from the admin says [highlight]its not computer related topic[/highlight]

infoseeker

2k_dummy · « **Reply #16 on:** July 30, 2006, 08:05:30 AM »

I've said it before, I'll say it again. Race, religion, and politics should not be discused in this forum. These subjects eventually lead to harsh words and bad feelings, and drive away members (to wit: Mac). There are forums specifically for such discussions, but CH is not one of them. With all due respect to the CH membership, I feel that DL65 did what was right for this forum.

johnchain · « **Reply #17 on:** July 30, 2006, 09:18:24 AM »

Agreed

Flame · « **Reply #18 on:** July 30, 2006, 09:22:08 AM »

Hey, Hopester's back

Flame

GX1_Man · « **Reply #19 on:** July 30, 2006, 09:26:19 AM »

Back and raising *censored*!

Hopester Doofus · « **Reply #20 on:** July 30, 2006, 10:22:44 AM »

Quote

Quote
You're missing the point, friend. A lot of the members above have expressed a willingness for the Other category to be open to the occasional non-computer related topic of discussion. As this forum is driven by the membership, you should be amenable to that if it doesn't detract from the site.
In any event, this is a call better suited for Nathan, not yourself. You've overstepped.

one thing for sure, im not missing the point Hipster Doofus
and im not overstepping anyone here
or maybe youre the one who did not get my points of view
thats why im asking why not putting a section for "OFF TOPIC" a non computer related topic section

[size=16]its only my opinion[/size], because as i said i experienced already here
i started a topic in"other" and someone from the admin says [highlight]its not computer related topic[/highlight]

infoseeker

That post was meant for dl. I meant to modify it and include his post, but apparently I don't have the option to do that for some reason.

I've apparently done all the damage I can do here. Perhaps I should just slip back into the shadows now, unless there's anybody else I can think of to offend.

GX1_Man · « **Reply #21 on:** July 30, 2006, 10:42:24 AM »

Me too, me too!

panboy · « **Reply #22 on:** July 31, 2006, 02:53:24 AM »

Juck that got nasty, these topic's should be avoided at all costs,

I had thought that the other forum was For posting Anything, But if thats not the Case , any point i tried to make is Null and Void return 0;

R0SS · « **Reply #23 on:** July 31, 2006, 05:48:34 AM »

How about we make a trial "Anything Else" Bored,
Keep it high moderated

No religious stuff or anything that could cause offence.

We all spend tones of time here and perhaps an Off topic board would be a good thing as it would let us get to know each other better.

If you really wanted you could only make it viewable to people with a certain post count or something that way the regulars can talk to each toher etc.

its just a idea.

R0SS

Neil · « **Reply #24 on:** July 31, 2006, 06:32:26 AM »

It's not really an "Anything else" board if you ban half the stuff. Religion is only a problem when people don't respect each other... everybody seemed pretty respectful here.

Hopester Doofus · « **Reply #25 on:** July 31, 2006, 07:16:04 AM »

Quote

It's not really an "Anything else" board if you ban half the stuff. Religion is only a problem when people don't respect each other... everybody seemed pretty respectful here.

Bingo.

dl65 · « **Reply #26 on:** July 31, 2006, 01:05:55 PM »

I have been looking to see if it's possible to create a off-topic board ....... but it appears only the admin can do that .........
Flame may be able to confirm this as I think he has been playing around with the YaBB 2.1 forums

dl65

GX1_Man · « **Reply #27 on:** July 31, 2006, 04:02:51 PM »

Yes, it would require Nathan, if he ever comes back.

Neil · « **Reply #28 on:** July 31, 2006, 05:37:07 PM »

What does Nathan actually do? Is Computer Hope a real company?

R0SS · « **Reply #29 on:** July 31, 2006, 05:52:28 PM »

he is the main Administrator so he has overall power of the forums.

R0SS

Zylstra · « **Reply #30 on:** July 31, 2006, 07:20:10 PM »

This forum has suffered many religion posts, and luckily, there have been moderators to remove them.
Everyone here is trying to stop people like "Mac" and all of his aliases already.
I do not believe that the post should have been removed myself, but obviously, DL65 thought that it was in his best interest to remove it.

DL65 is a moderator, and has done what he feels is making the boards better.

Is this abuse of power? That's not for any of us to say. That's up to the admin...

GX1_Man · « **Reply #31 on:** July 31, 2006, 08:19:00 PM »

I don't see any mods fighting.

johnchain · « **Reply #32 on:** July 31, 2006, 10:24:10 PM »

If I were to take my BESTEST guess, I think the Computer Hope mods settle it the manly way, which fairly settles arguments and leaves no room for complaining.......................

Rock-Paper-Scissors

Hopester Doofus · « **Reply #33 on:** August 01, 2006, 12:16:44 AM »

Quote

This forum has suffered many religion posts, and luckily, there have been moderators to remove them. Everyone here is trying to stop people like "Mac" and all of his aliases already.

Big difference. None of the people discussing the topic were raving lunatics, and Mac had no respect or tolerance for the opinions of others.

Quote

I do not believe that the post should have been removed myself, but obviously, DL65 thought that it was in his best interest to remove it.

DL65 is a moderator, and has done what he feels is making the boards better.

Based on his personal opinion, and without inviting the input of the parties involved prior. The half dozen or so people participating in the thread would beg to differ that the thread was inappropriate, but apparently those opinions didn't merit serious consideration. It was a heavy-handed approach which could have, and should have, been handled differently.

Quote

Is this abuse of power? That's not for any of us to say. That's up to the admin...

Then it should be left up to the admin. Even with privileges, I would never even consider the notion of wiping out an entire thread without first bouncing it off Nathan, regardless of my motivations. It's just a little too easy.

Is it just religion? How about the occasional political reference that doesn't have direct relevance to IT? Or a comment on world affairs? Or the weather? It's a big forum, and the occasional dalliance won't bring it to its knees. Is there anything in the ComputerHope rules that prohibits particular topics of discussion? I can't find it.

dl65 · « **Reply #34 on:** August 01, 2006, 12:38:06 AM »

Hopester Doofus..... For some reason unknown to me you appear to want to create a mountain out of a mole hill.

Quote

Is it just religion? How about the occasional political reference that doesn't have direct relevance to IT? Or a comment on world affairs? Or the weather? It's a big forum, and the occasional dalliance won't bring it to its knees. Is there anything in the ComputerHope rules that prohibits particular topics of discussion? I can't find it.

......
I will say this again , the reason for closing and locking the post was nothing other than it was completely Off -Topic . Please note I did not remove it , just closed it .
I made a decision based on what I believe to be in the best interest of the forum. You choose to disagree with me and I can can certainly respect your opinion.

dl65

johnchain · « **Reply #35 on:** August 01, 2006, 02:18:33 PM »

The forum states Other "Discussions and help with everything else."

Everything else

Other defined as (thank you webster) "Different from that or those implied or specified"

I believe that the topic was appropriate for this forum.

If the intention of closing the forum was because it went off-topic from the original subject "Is this appropriate" then I completely agree, it was absolutely the correct action to put forth.

Quote

I will say this again , the reason for closing and locking the post was nothing other than it was completely Off -Topic

Isn't the name of the forum implying "Off Topic"?

Say for example that we started a forum topic in Other called "Religious connections to science" (maybe computer science if it makes Computer Hope happy), and if nothing was offensive (well, of course it will be offensive......but rather nothing for malicious intent).....would you make the same decision?

dl65 · « **Reply #36 on:** August 01, 2006, 03:53:38 PM »

johnchain......

Quote

Say for example that we started a forum topic in Other called "Religious connections to science"

The Term "Other" as used on the Computer Hope forum refers to "Other" computer related issues not specificaly defined in the headers of the rest of the board.
For Example ...if the issue was related to the use of say Internet Explorer ........ the post would go in the "Internet Explorer" section ...... If it was a driver issue ...then post it in "Drivers" ..... and so on .........
Lets say the issue was say a dust build up on the monitor screen , it would be appropriate to post in the "Other" section. I trust that explains things

dl65

2k_dummy · « **Reply #37 on:** August 01, 2006, 04:01:52 PM »

I think the key word is "help".

# To give assistance to; aid.
# To contribute to the furtherance of; promote.

johnchain · « **Reply #38 on:** August 01, 2006, 04:57:23 PM »

I agree then dl65. I believe the solution to this is to modify the Other Forum description from

"Discussions and help with everything else."

to....

"Discussions and help with any other computer related issues"

squirrel · « **Reply #39 on:** August 01, 2006, 05:00:57 PM »

then we'd need a new board for stuff like this. :-/

homer · « **Reply #40 on:** August 01, 2006, 05:37:04 PM »

we all just need to relax and have a nice cold beer. [smiley=beer.gif]

Zylstra · « **Reply #41 on:** August 01, 2006, 06:15:15 PM »

Well, email the admin then and ask that the board description be revised, and that an off-topic board be added.

johnchain · « **Reply #42 on:** August 01, 2006, 08:36:16 PM »

I'm underage for beer............but I still agree

SilentAssasin64 · « **Reply #43 on:** August 01, 2006, 09:10:57 PM »

Alright, just my 2 cents but here goes...

Even without even reading the thread in question I feel that dl65 did the correct thing. He is a moderator correct? Why do you think he is one? There's got to be a good reason right? dl65 did what he thought was right for the forum (even though many people may not agree) and everyone should respect that.

If a mod closes a topic or deletes a post it is for a reason. That reason may be unclear to you but they know why they did it and people should respect their decision, just like you would want people to respect yours.

If you don't agree with the decision of a mod then contact them...ask them why they did whatever they did to see if you can understand the reasoning behind it.

Just my $0.02 though...

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