Email Accounts, the REAL test

[Zylstra]

I was discussing with my cousin earlier today about email.
He has Yahoo, I have Hotmail. He wants to switch to Gmail.

I am going to do the following:
Make up email addresses with the initials S B
The gender Male
The age 26

and the address will be supafly40@

And the initial test happens here, I post the addresses in plain text
--Moderators, these are disposable addresses and intended for testing. Please do not remove--
[email protected]
[email protected]
[email protected]

and now we wait

[Zylstra]

At a glance:
I have used Hotmail and Gmail before. I was not at all impressed with Gmail.
Gmail is somewhat dynamic, but hardly. There are no drag/drop capabilities, and the folders dont really function all that well.

Hotmail and Yahoo seem to match up when it comes to how dynamic they are (very web2.0 compliant)
Opening the text of an email is certainly faster in Yahoo, but it takes just as long for the images to load as they did in Hotmail.
Yahoo takes up a smaller area of the screen (1024x768) and has wasted space.
It does seem fact that either my little "Check email" button wasnt working, or the Yahoo servers are slow at receiving emails.

Yahoo mail does have a RSS feed reader/handler, but Gmail and Hotmail do not have these built into the email clients access.

Yahoo does seem to have a slower initial load time compared to Hotmail, and it keeps giving me these little annoying popup overlays (it reminds me of those annoying ads that scroll across your screen)

When I log into my email, I want it to come up ASAP, no little notices or ads or notications of future versions. In this area, Hotmail and Gmail beat Yahoo.
(GAH! I click "Continue" and MORE popup things appear!)

It seems that both Gmail and Yahoo have a built in chat feature. (Kind of neat)

[WillyW]

...
When I log into my email, I want it to come up ASAP, no little notices or ads or notications of future versions.

Considered using Thunderbird on Hotmail, Yahoo, and Gmail?

[soybean]

I haven't used Hotmail or Gmail.  So, I can't compare them with Yahoo Mail, and, even though I have a Yahoo Mail account, I've used it very little since my mail account is with my ISP, Earthlink, and that's what I normally use.  With Earthlink, I normally download my mail to Outlook Express.  However, I also logon to Earthlink's WebMail almost daily, where I can also check my mail. 

Anyway, a couple of your comments about Yahoo seemed to contradict my observations, based on my limited use of Yahoo Mail.   

Yahoo takes up a smaller area of the screen (1024x768) and has wasted space.

I normally use 1024x768 resolution but increased it to 1152x864 to do a test.  Based on that, I don't follow your comment on the resolution.

Yahoo does seem to have a slower initial load time compared to Hotmail ....

Seems fine to me.  It's basically the same responsiveness as being on the web and viewing web pages in general.

... it keeps giving me these little annoying popup overlays (it reminds me of those annoying ads that scroll across your screen)

Exactly what screen are you talking about?  I don't see popups when I'm viewing messages in Inbox.  From what I've seen, popups may appear on the main Mail screen, the screen shown here: http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y256/farmpond/forums/Yahoo1.jpg.  But, they won't appear when the Inbox or other mail folders have been opened. 

It does seem fact that either my little "Check email" button wasnt working, or the Yahoo servers are slow at receiving emails.

I just did a test.  I forwarded an HTML email newsletter from my Earthlink account via Outlook Express to my Yahoo Mail account.  I then immediately logged onto Yahoo and the message was there.  I then sent another HTML email newsletter.  It then refreshed my Yahoo Inbox window within about 2 seconds and the message was there.

So, Yahoo Mail looks good to me.  But, again, I haven't compared it to Hotmail and Gmail.  I see that a new beta version of Yahoo Mail is available.  A preview of it can be seen by logging on to your Yahoo Mail account and following the link for Switch to the new Yahoo! Mail. 

[Zylstra]

I should probably mention, I am using the Beta version of Yahoo Mail
Also, the FireFox web browser

I guess the pop-up things were for new users, but they were overlays

The Beta version is probably what affected the screen sizes. I decided to use the Beta version since its the newest technology from their mail department.

It took a few minutes for the email to get to the box, but it did make it

Found one of the pop-ups!

...
When I log into my email, I want it to come up ASAP, no little notices or ads or notications of future versions.

Considered using Thunderbird on Hotmail, Yahoo, and Gmail?

Without some difficult to use addons, its kind of hard to do that (I say this from personal experience)

[WillyW]

Considered using Thunderbird on Hotmail, Yahoo, and Gmail?

Without some difficult to use addons, its kind of hard to do that (I say this from personal experience)

Sorry to hear that.    My experience with them has been just the opposite.

It has been a while since I installed the Webmail extension, and the Hotmail and Yahoo extensions.      I don't recall any major problems though.

Using them daily (until recently - more on that in a moment)  has been equally as simple as simple as using a regular pop email account.   
Click on "Get Mail",  enter password,  watch the mail download. 

Just recently, the Yahoo extension has not allowed mail to send.  Still recieves fine.    The problem is that I'm still using T-Bird 1.5 - it is still supported for a few more months.    2.0 is out now.
Yahoo changed something on their end.
The author of the extension is now supporting only the extension for Webmail for T-Bird 2.0.
There is a work-around that I haven't finished experimenting with yet.
Obviously,      I'm not too worried about that Yahoo account.

Or,  I could go ahead and upgrade to T-Bird 2.0 now.

Prior to this,  I had zero problems with the Webmail extension, the Hotmail extension, and the Yahoo extension.      Use them daily.       I consider the present thing with Yahoo to be minor, now that I know what the deal is.


How long ago did you experience the extensions as being difficult to use?
Perhaps they've made changes now.



p.s.  Gmail requires no extension

[Calum]

Or,  I could go ahead and upgrade to T-Bird 2.0 now.

Can I ask why you haven't already done so?
I've been using it since it was released, and have noticed no issues at all.

[patio]

TBird + GMail = no problems at all....

Yahoo requires a plugin.

Hotmail can be skewered into doing it properly but why waste the effort ?

[WillyW]

Or,  I could go ahead and upgrade to T-Bird 2.0 now.

Can I ask why you haven't already done so?
I've been using it since it was released, and have noticed no issues at all.

I can't remember the details off the top of my head.    Read something, over in the mozillazine forums, I think.    Some minor quirks that I didn't care for.
That,  and the old custom of waiting a while, after a new release of anything comes out.   Let them get the kinks worked out.

Have you heard anything about any issues when using v2.0 on older Pentium machines and with Win98?

[WillyW]

TBird + GMail = no problems at all....

Yahoo requires a plugin.

Hotmail can be skewered into doing it properly but why waste the effort ?

Hotmail uses an extension,  just as Yahoo does.      Effort is the same.   Very little.   

[patio]

I have zero issues with ThunderBird.

[Zylstra]

The major problem I have with the Thunderbird Extension for Hotmail is that it does not organize into HTTP folders, which causes a major problem for me, since I use my computer in various locations, and I archive everything on the server
I just dont like only having a "Inbox" connected to the server, I like having all my other folders

(Unless I just got a goofy installation and it will retrive the individual folders)

[Zylstra]

I will declair the test somewhat unfair, I made a bit of a typo in the Hotmail address

Junk count:
Hotmail - 0*
Gmail - 0
Yahoo - 2
(*A variable may have yielded different test results)

Since the Yahoo address and Gmail received different amounts of spam, it suggests a possibility that Yahoo uses the Junk folder for sucky advertisements....
We will find out, but there is no way to tell if it was a bot or a sold address.
(At least it was in the spam folder)

Email count will not be a total, it will only be what is in the box when it is checked

[patio]

The major problem I have with the Thunderbird Extension for Hotmail is that it does not organize into HTTP folders, which causes a major problem for me, since I use my computer in various locations, and I archive everything on the server
I just dont like only having a "Inbox" connected to the server, I like having all my other folders

(Unless I just got a goofy installation and it will retrive the individual folders)

Sounds like you need portable Thunderbird and Firefox...

Here Ya Go...

[WillyW]

The major problem I have with the Thunderbird Extension for Hotmail is that it does not organize into HTTP folders, which causes a major problem for me, since I use my computer in various locations, and I archive everything on the server
I just dont like only having a "Inbox" connected to the server, I like having all my other folders

(Unless I just got a goofy installation and it will retrive the individual folders)

I think I'm understanding you - need to be sure.
You access your hotmail email account via the web interface from more than one computer.
You have several folders in your hotmail account.
Either manually or via some filters,  you sort your mail -  moving it out of the main inbox into these other folders.
When you tried out the Hotmail extension with T-Bird,  you didn't like it because it only picked up whatever mail was in the main inbox.
Did I understand?


For what it is worth:
I saw withing the Options of the Hotmail extension what appeared to be a way to configure to pick up mail from other folders.   
Having never used it myself,  I couldn't comment on it.
So I did a quick experiment for you.

Used hotmail via the web to create three folders.
Sent myself three emails.
Using web,  moved one to each new folder.
Went to Options within Hotmail extension,  and added the three new folders.
Used T-Bird.  "Get Mail".         Presto!   it picked up the three new emails from those three folders.   
Note:   The three emails did land in the Inbox for that hotmail account within T-Bird.    I suppose that if I wanted to create the three corresponding folders within T-Bird and have T-Bird sort them upon receiving,  I'd have to fiddle around with T-Bird's filters.    I didn't go that far.   


I'm not trying to 'sell' you on T-Bird, extensions, etc. either.     This is just in the spirit of a forum -   share info, it might be beneficial. 
I hope it is.     

[Zylstra]

The major problem I have with the Thunderbird Extension for Hotmail is that it does not organize into HTTP folders, which causes a major problem for me, since I use my computer in various locations, and I archive everything on the server
I just dont like only having a "Inbox" connected to the server, I like having all my other folders

(Unless I just got a goofy installation and it will retrive the individual folders)

Sounds like you need portable Thunderbird and Firefox...

Here Ya Go...

I have used both of those, with an actual installation and on a U3 device, and a regular portable app.
I was not overly impressed with Thunderbird, but if I was using a POP3 server, it would be great.

FireFox is something I use every day without a problem

WillyW:
I dont use the web interface, its not a favorite of mine. There is a protocol similar to IMAP and POP3 called an HTTP Email protocol.
It is able to manage your folders on the web server without any problems.
You can remotely create folders, delete them, and ultimately, read the individual emails.
When you read an email, it marks the servers email status to read. When you move an email, it moves it on the server.

This works great for when you have many folders. I use various computers, so this is something I have to have.

[Zylstra]

A spam update:

No new spam for the Yahoo or Gmail accounts
One new spam email for Hotmail.

All emails have been filtered appropriately so far

Total count:
Yahoo 2
Hotmail 1
Gmail

Since Hotmail only keeps junk for a week, and Gmail and Yahoo keep it for 30 days, I have decided to change the way the count works. All junk email is moved into a separate folder

[Zylstra]

Lastest results from Today:

Still no spam in the Gmail account
No new spam in the Hotmail account
4 New junk emails for the Yahoo account

Totals:
Gmail - 0
Yahoo - 5
Hotmail -1

[Zylstra]

No new spam in the Hotmail account
No new spam in the Gmail account ("Hooray, no spam here!")
5 new spam email in the Yahoo account

Totals:
Gmail - 0
Yahoo - 10
Hotmail -1

Looks like Gmail is holding up, and Hotmail is next in the list.
Yahoo is just killing itself.

Which makes me wonder:
Why is it that the Hotmail and Gmail accounts are showing greatly lesser numbers then Yahoo?
(I really am wondering if the address was sold...)

[soybean]

Exactly what are you calling spam?  I don't use my Yahoo mail account; I have it merely because I installed Yahoo Messenger for the PC-to-phone feature.  But, I've had the Yahoo Mail account for about 6 months now and the only mail I've received has been a half dozen or so messages from Yahoo itself.  Is that what you're calling spam?

What usage have you made of the three accounts in your test?  In other words, have you actually used them to send mail to friends or what?

The way I see it, no one besides Yahoo and me knows that this account exists, even after 6 months.

[WillyW]

What usage have you made of the three accounts in your test?  In other words, have you actually used them to send mail to friends or what?

I thought he was testing web crawling harvesters.    That's how I interpreted the first post in this thread.

The way I see it, no one besides Yahoo and me knows that this account exists, even after 6 months.

I'm like you.   I have a Yahoo email account that I've only used a couple times,  and that was just to send  test email to myself.
It gets zero spam.

[Zylstra]

WillyW is correct

These are not used for personal email

Junk is considered anything delivered to the boxes that is containing advertisements or trying to sell something, or scams

Screenshot of the Spam
[img=http://img510.imageshack.us/img510/6589/spamtc8.th.png]

[soybean]

OK, so this is the result of posting the email addresses in your original post.  Is that right?  And, the "web crawling harvesters" have resulted in more spam going to the Yahoo account than the other two.  Right? 

Actually, the web crawling harvesters may be causing about the same volume of spam to the other two, shall we say, behind the scenes, but it does not appear in them because of their filtering or blocking mechanism.  Do you agree?  And, that's exactly your point.  Less spam has appeared in the  Gmail and Hotmail accounts. 

I just looked again at Yahoo Mail's options and found a Spam Filter feature where the user can set certain preferences regarding spam control.  I wonder whether using certain settings there would result in Yahoo also receiving little or no spam in the Inbox.  I'd bet it would. 

Here's a screen print of the Yahoo Mail spam control options:
http://s7.photobucket.com/albums/y256/farmpond/forums/?action=view&current=Yahoo2.jpg

[Zylstra]

Ah, but what if I was really using these accounts and I didn't want to risk loosing my friends emails to the SPAM filters?

Hotmail delivers all SPAM to the SPAM folder.
Gmail does not seem to have much of a configuration for its SPAM, so I cant say as to what it does to deal with it.

I once used the "Delete on receive" option, but really, when it comes down to it, a lot of stuff can get deleted by accident that way. (Forum registrations especially, and other web services)

[soybean]

And, Yahoo can send them to the Bulk folder.  So, I see no significant difference between Hotmail and Yahoo.  In both cases, spam can be directed to a special folder.

[Zylstra]

And, Yahoo can send them to the Bulk folder.  So, I see no significant difference between Hotmail and Yahoo.  In both cases, spam can be directed to a special folder.

But that does not explain why Yahoo has more than Hotmail.
They both direct all junk to the SPAM folder

[soybean]

They both direct all junk to the SPAM folder

On the link to an image I posted in my previous post, it specifically says Yahoo directs the spam to the "Bulk" folder.  There is no "Spam" folder. 

[Zylstra]

They both direct all junk to the SPAM folder

On the link to an image I posted in my previous post, it specifically says Yahoo directs the spam to the "Bulk" folder.  There is no "Spam" folder. 

Since Yahoo is moving on to a newer version (the BETA version right now...) they have renamed "Bulk" to "SPAM"
Probably to keep up with new users who don't understand the difference... even if there isn't one 

[Zylstra]

One new spam message in the Hotmail account
No new spam in the Gmail account ("Hooray, no spam here!")
10 new spam email in the Yahoo account

Totals:
Gmail - 0
Yahoo - 20
Hotmail -2

Looks like Gmail is holding up, and Hotmail is next in the list.
Yahoo is just killing itself.

Which makes me wonder:
Why is it that the Hotmail and Gmail accounts are showing greatly lesser numbers then Yahoo?
(I really am wondering if the address was sold...)

[WillyW]

...
Which makes me wonder:
Why is it that the Hotmail and Gmail accounts are showing greatly lesser numbers then Yahoo?
(I really am wondering if the address was sold...)

Just to be sure:
The email addresses were not used for anything else, correct?  ... just displayed here in this thread?   and only here?



This is very interesting.     
   
Wow... can you just imagine....  what would happen if word got out that Yahoo was selling email addresses?       That's the first reason that comes to mind to dispell your theory.      Not saying that your theory is not possible...  just looking at the other side.

Here's another idea to kick around -   supposing that some sort of email harvesting software found this thread and those email addresses,   is it possible that yahoo email addresses are more attractive "bait",  and noted-
whereas the others are not?   

[soybean]

Here's another idea to kick around -   supposing that some sort of email harvesting software found this thread and those email addresses,   is it possible that yahoo email addresses are more attractive "bait",  and noted-
whereas the others are not?   

I wondered about that, too.  I quite sure Yahoo does not sell email addresses.  As I said in an earlier post, I've had a Yahoo account for 5 or 6 months and have not received any spam; as I said in that post, I do not use the account; it exists because I use Yahoo Messenger.

[WillyW]

Here's another idea to kick around -   supposing that some sort of email harvesting software found this thread and those email addresses,   is it possible that yahoo email addresses are more attractive "bait",  and noted-
whereas the others are not?   

I wondered about that, too. 
...

and I forgot to end with:   If they are more attractive,   then I wonder why?

[Zylstra]

These email accounts are not being used for anything else.
They are only being used for the purpose of testing.

Now, in all honesty, the Gmail account is not the same address as the Yahoo and Hotmail account, due to my memory... but then, in that case, Hotmail should get as much junk as Yahoo, so I dont see that being a problem altering ...

[soybean]

These email accounts are not being used for anything else.
They are only being used for the purpose of testing.

What's your point?  We know These email accounts are not being used for anything else.  But, they're posted on this website and, thus, have their butts exposed to the public, to the "web crawling harvesters".  My and WillyW's Yahoo accounts are not (see posts #19 and #20) exposed on a website and have received no spam.

Now, in all honesty, the Gmail account is not the same address as the Yahoo and Hotmail account, due to my memory... but then, in that case, Hotmail should get as much junk as Yahoo, so I dont see that being a problem altering ...

  They're all different, one is Gmail, one is Hotmail, and one is Yahoo.   

[Zylstra]

These email accounts are not being used for anything else.
They are only being used for the purpose of testing.

What's your point?  We know These email accounts are not being used for anything else.  But, they're posted on this website and, thus, have their butts exposed to the public, to the "web crawling harvesters".  My and WillyW's Yahoo accounts are not (see posts #19 and #20) exposed on a website and have received no spam.

WillyW asked again to confirm that they were not being used for anything else

They have all been exposed to the public, yes, but why the Yahoo account?

It could be that more spambots are customized to work for Yahoo, and not Hotmail or Gmail.
Gmail I can understand, but both Yahoo and Hotmail are at the top of the list for email accounts...