Non-Standard Disc

[Barefoot_Tom]

My wife has a computerized knitting machine which uses pattern programs stored on 3.5 inch discs. These discs are formatted using a proprietary format developed by Tandy in the mid-'80s. They are designed to be read by a Tandy 100 disk Drive, which unfortunately has died. We are seeking someone who can repair this obsolete disk drive, but so far no luck.

Does anyone know of a program which can read these discs so that they can be stored on a PC hard drive? If so, my wife has a program which will let her transfer the files into the knitting machine from the PC.

[truenorth]

Have you tried to contact the knitting machine manufacturer (if they still are around) to see if they have software available on a current media that can be used on more modern computers? truenorth

[Computer_Commando]

Model 100 Users Group

[Barefoot_Tom]

The disk drive was made by Tandy, and was sold by a Japanese company called Knitking. The knitting machine was made by Brother and was also sold in this country by Knitking. Neither Tandy nor Knitking exist today, and Brother no longer makes knitting machines.

I've been in touch with Model 100 Users Group, and Rick Hanson was very helpful so far as parts for the drive were concerned. He doesn't, however, know of any program that will read the disc.

[patio]

Can you see the filenaames in Explorer ? ?
Perhaps if we had a few file extensions it would narrow things down a bit...

[BC_Programmer]

Can you see the filenaames in Explorer ? ?
Perhaps if we had a few file extensions it would narrow things down a bit...

The disk format is not readable by a standard floppy drive.

That's why they need a "special" drive to read it:

These discs are formatted using a proprietary format developed by Tandy in the mid-'80s. They are designed to be read by a Tandy 100 disk Drive, which unfortunately has died.

I would have guessed that there are programs to read the disks anyway, much as there are programs for reading mac formatted disks in a standard 3.5" drive. But that doesn't seem to be the case.

[patio]

Not sure why it wouldn't be "read" by a standard floppy drive...the Tandy would have to have i guess a firmware modification.

[BC_Programmer]

Not sure why it wouldn't be "read" by a standard floppy drive...the Tandy would have to have i guess a firmware modification.

A standard 3-1/2" floppy drive is controlled by the BIOS. the BIOS knows how to read two formats natively: FAT12 720K and FAT12 1440K. There is some hardware in the floppy drive itself for these two formats (witness the hole to determine if a disk is 1440 or 720K).

However, even if it did know how to read- say, these disks- it still wouldn't know it was reading one of those disks. The only reason it can even tell a 720K disk and a 1440K disk apart is because of the hole in the disk itself. I have a old 3-1/2" floppy somewhere which replaced the "sensor" that detects the hole with a hardwired switch. putting the switch in "720K mode" with a 1440K disk caused a "General Error reading Drive A" same in the other direction.

However, the floppy drive can of course be controlled directly by software. In the case of a Macintosh disk, which uses a 800K HFS format, the application takes complete control of the floppy drive, and since the software knows how to make sense of the disk format and what the floppy drive gives it back, it's possible to read it.

a tandy-100 disk is a 3-1/2" disk, but just because it fits in the same drive doesn't automatically mean that you can read it. Just as you don't expect to be able to read a DVD in a CD-drive it's unreasonable to assume that just because the shoe fits, it should be comfortable.

One analogy that might make sense is to think in terms of applications. Microsoft Word, for example, can read say, crysis save files, but it can't make sense out of them. a 3-1/2" standard floppy drive might be able to read a Tandy disk, but it can't make sense out of it, and the built in floppy driver on PCs isn't going to be able to help either. Thus the need for proprietary software.

[truenorth]

I have endeavored to find a replacement disc drive to replace your damaged one. Here is a link to a site in the U.S. that lists one at $255.00  (ouch--but that may be acceptable to you). I would call them before ordering it to absolutely make sure it is for your machine.
http://www.daisyknits.com/machinesforsale.htm
Here is what appears to be a Canadian site offering a couple of Brother complete machines.http://www.pineridgeknitsew.com/used_knitting_machines_for_sale.htm
Finally here is a site devoted to knitting machines (including many references to Brother) that through contact may be able to assist you in locating parts. http://www.needlesknitting.net/pages/brother+350+knitting+machine.html
Good-luck,truenorth

[Computer_Commando]

The disk drive was made by Tandy, and was sold by a Japanese company called Knitking. The knitting machine was made by Brother and was also sold in this country by Knitking. Neither Tandy nor Knitking exist today, and Brother no longer makes knitting machines.

I've been in touch with Model 100 Users Group, and Rick Hanson was very helpful so far as parts for the drive were concerned. He doesn't, however, know of any program that will read the disc.

This might be a better option:  http://www.allbrands.com/products/abp28102.html

[Barefoot_Tom]

I've checked the URL, and it points me towrd a program called a Disk Emulator. This program will allow one to read knitting patterns already loaded on the computer, and, with the purchase of a special cable, transfer them to a knitting machine. It will not read non-standard disks.

[Computer_Commando]

You have misunderstood my suggestion.  You're not going to read those disks without a Tandy 100 disk drive.  I believe you can still utilize the knitting machine with the SilverKnit program.  You'll have to research that for yourself.

[Barefoot_Tom]

Sorry about the misunderstanding. The problem that exists is not that the knitting machine can't be used; nor is it that patterns can't be transferred from the computer to the machine. Both can be done. The problem is that there are a number of patterns on disks which can't be read anymore by the Tandy disk drive. I'm searching for a program which will allow an IBM PC to read those disks. Theoretically, such a program would not be difficult to write, but I'm not aware of anyone having done so. I thought someone in this group might know of such a program, or even have a suggestion as to where to go to find out if one exists.

[rthompson80819]

Since you didn't mention it, I've got to ask.  Have you contacted Radio Shack (not a local store)?  They bought Tandy in 1963, and phased out the name Tandy, and maybe you can find an old timer that knows something about the drive.  Their corporate office is based in Fort Worth, TX.

I know it's a long shot, but worth a try.

[Geek-9pm]

Besides the issue of disk format,
there is the  issue of  file structure.