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Author Topic: The Fermi paradox  (Read 7796 times)

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Spero-T

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The Fermi paradox
« on: August 29, 2007, 07:42:28 AM »
The Fermi paradox is the apparent contradiction between high estimates of the probability of the existence of extraterrestrial civilizations and the lack of evidence for or contact with such civilizations.

The extreme age of the universe and its vast number of stars suggest that if the Earth is typical, extraterrestrial life should be common. Discussing this proposition with colleagues over lunch in 1950, the physicist Enrico Fermi asked: "Where are they?" (alternatively, "Where is everybody?")  Fermi questioned why, if a multitude of advanced extraterrestrial civilizations exist in the Milky Way galaxy, evidence such as probes, spacecraft, or radio transmissions has not been found. Fermi is widely credited with simplifying the problem of the probability of extraterrestrial life. Wider examination of the implications of the topic began with Michael Hart in 1975, and it is sometimes referred to as the Fermi-Hart paradox.

There have been attempts to resolve the Fermi Paradox by locating evidence of extraterrestrial civilizations, along with proposals that such life could exist without human knowledge. Counterarguments suggest that intelligent extraterrestrial life does not exist or occurs so rarely that humans will never make contact with it.

A great deal of effort has gone into developing scientific theories and possible models of extraterrestrial life and the Fermi paradox has become a theoretical reference point in much of this work. The problem has spawned numerous scholarly works addressing it directly, while various questions that relate to it have been addressed in fields as diverse as astronomy, biology, ecology and philosophy. The emerging field of astrobiology has brought an interdisciplinary approach to the Fermi paradox and the question of extraterrestrial life.

I wonder what your veiws are   ?

Deerpark



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    Re: The Fermi paradox
    « Reply #1 on: August 29, 2007, 09:19:50 AM »
    The best explanation for the Fermi Paradox I've heard is that humans need to get over ourselves and realize alien species might not find it worth while to make contact with us. We might simply not be interesting or advanced enough for other species to take notice of us.

    Or everyone else is following the Prime Directive and wont make contact with us before we attain warp technology. :P </star trek geek>
    Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
    Arthur C. Clarke (1917 - 2008)

    Spero-T

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    Re: The Fermi paradox
    « Reply #2 on: August 29, 2007, 09:56:52 AM »
    Prime Directive....

    But dont forget it has been broken on many occations....

    Richenstony

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    Re: The Fermi paradox
    « Reply #3 on: August 29, 2007, 10:26:21 AM »
    The best explanation for the Fermi Paradox I've heard is that humans need to get over ourselves and realize alien species might not find it worth while to make contact with us. We might simply not be interesting or advanced enough for other species to take notice of us.

    Or everyone else is following the Prime Directive and wont make contact with us before we attain warp technology. :P </star trek geek>
    next generation or voyager.......  ??? ??? :D choose wisely

    Deerpark



      Egghead
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      Re: The Fermi paradox
      « Reply #4 on: August 29, 2007, 11:14:42 AM »
      Next generation... but nothing beats the original series, pure camp. :)
      Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
      Arthur C. Clarke (1917 - 2008)

      Richenstony

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      Re: The Fermi paradox
      « Reply #5 on: August 29, 2007, 11:27:10 AM »
      OH YESSSSSSS WOO the next generation  kicks *censored* !! everyone i know likes the other one yuk  :-X and yh the orginal  is funny , spock !! LOok OuT !! its ok i will attack him with my mellow dramtic voice !!! haha i love spock , but NO and i mean no-one not even william shatner beats partick stewart !! hes a badass!!

      Deerpark



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        Re: The Fermi paradox
        « Reply #6 on: August 29, 2007, 12:37:26 PM »
        Hehe yeah Voyager sucks. :)
        But I've just started watching Enterprise and much to my surprise I really like it. Although it probably got the worst theme song in the history of television. :D
        Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.
        Arthur C. Clarke (1917 - 2008)

        Richenstony

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        Re: The Fermi paradox
        « Reply #7 on: August 29, 2007, 12:45:03 PM »
        Enterprise is ok ..... its not any where near as bad as V ....................Commander Data.. he is so *censored* good makes me laugh ........ but i cant feel can i Geordi.... no data you cant !!! how COLD!! man im gunna have to start watching some again ..... i watched it before skyone got taken away from me!! :(  brent spiner is a God send ...

        patio

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        Re: The Fermi paradox
        « Reply #8 on: August 29, 2007, 06:04:29 PM »
        The Fermi Paradox is actually not a paradox at all for a few simple reasons...

        1) It assumes not only the size of the galaxy but how many planet's in the Universe on a mere calculation would be identical to Earth and have the ability to support life as we know it.

        2) If it were a true paradox it would speculate that maybe other planetary makeups could support a form of life completely different from what we consider life...i.e. there could in fact be a planet made up of 80% ammonia which would kill off life as we know it but may be a healthy sustainable enviornment for a totally different life form.

        3) He is foolish enough to state the assumption " If the Earth is typical" ...all of our scientific research in the history of civilised Man obviously illustrates  that as far as we can tell the Earth is in fact an anamoly...no planet has even come close to the makeup of Earth. If his math held up we have been able to see far enough that there would be something similar somewhere.

        4) And the last one that get's my dog riled up...cause he reads alot...is the assumption that there are other civilisations out there...they're just so advanced that they choose not to bother with us.
           Using this advanced set of logic there would be an equal number of civilisations out there that would be equally stupid enough to run into us and hang around doing mundane tasks and reaping the rewards of a species more advanced than themselves.

        So to sum up it being called a paradox is in itself an egotistical summary...a paradox requires irrefutable science or known facts to exist...he gave himself way too much credibility or those that did by calling it a paradox.



        " Anyone who goes to a psychiatrist should have his head examined. "

        Spero-T

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        Re: The Fermi paradox
        « Reply #9 on: August 30, 2007, 02:57:16 AM »
        New planet 'may support life'
        Last Modified: 25 Apr 2007

        By: Tom Clarke

        A new planet, Gliese 581 C, contains the conditions required to support life, scientists say.

        Newly proposed planet, Gliese 581c is just over 120 trillion miles away. Travelling at the speed of light it would take 20 years for any message from Earth to get there.

        If they exist, and they'd been listening out for us today - the Gliesians might well be watching this...

        To be alive in the universe, you have to be lucky.

        There's life on Earth because our home planet orbits the Sun at just the right distance. On Mercury - it's just too hot, on Mars, a bit cold, but on Earth, it's just right. That's why scientists call this zone around our planet - the 'goldilocks zone.'

        Twenty light years away the new planet's solar system is a very very different place, but today's findings show it's just possible those fairytale conditions exist there too. Gliese 581 is much older and only half as warm as our Sun, but its new planet, Gliese 581c orbits much, much closer, soaking up that warmth. That puts it in the same zone as our Earth

        Using telescopes here at the European Southern Observatory, in Chile's Atacama desert Mayers' team detected a subtle wobble in the distant star likely caused by the orbiting planet. The orbit suggests temperatures between 0 and 40 degrees centigrade, that means their might be water. Warm, rocky and wet could mean life.

        New missions might be able to actually see planets like Gliese 581c, but until they do the existence of most small distant planets, inferred from wobbles, can't actually be confirmed.

        Bookies may have today revised their odds on the discovery of alien life within a year. The better odds are that Gliese 581c may not exist at all.


        Spero-T

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        Re: The Fermi paradox
        « Reply #10 on: August 30, 2007, 04:10:30 AM »
        Hehe yeah Voyager sucks. :)
        But I've just started watching Enterprise and much to my surprise I really like it. Although it probably got the worst theme song in the history of television. :D

        What do you mean Voyager sucks !! Janeway would kill Archer Nx-01... Ha i laugh at your tiny ship....

        Carbon Dudeoxide

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        Re: The Fermi paradox
        « Reply #11 on: August 30, 2007, 06:09:10 AM »
        I like Voyager's plot but I think Enterprise has more special effects. Only starting to watch the original series.

        Back on the original thread topic, I'm sure there are planets in this galaxy that supports life, question is how advanced are they? Do they even have the technology to go into space? Can they go to warp and be at earth in a matter of months?

        NinjaALor

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        Re: The Fermi paradox
        « Reply #12 on: August 30, 2007, 12:41:07 PM »
        Commander Data.. he is so d**n good makes me laugh ........ but i cant feel can i Geordi.... no data you cant !!!

        Well actually Data wouldn't have said this because he is incapable of contractions

        Richenstony

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        Re: The Fermi paradox
        « Reply #13 on: August 30, 2007, 12:45:40 PM »
        hehe


        well your wrong he did!!  ::)

        :P


        NinjaALor

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        Re: The Fermi paradox
        « Reply #14 on: August 30, 2007, 02:50:08 PM »
        When are your sure its not his evil brother? what episode? i don't think your right