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Author Topic: Do not Put Linux on a New Laptop  (Read 33585 times)

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camerongray



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Re: Do not Put Linux on a New Laptop
« Reply #30 on: August 18, 2014, 03:44:18 PM »
Tux2,

Thank you very much for your contribution to this thread.
About 150,000 computers have Computrace. It is an Anti-Theft measure. Computrace says about 70% or more laptops are recovered.  While Intel will discontinue its anit-theft software, others will continue to have some such implementation in the firmware of select laptops.
So now you are just not even going to respond to the fact that Secure Boot is not Anti Theft?  You have STILL not answered my three questions either.  Why is this?

You do this a lot, you will make nonsense claims and when people dispute them you just ignore responses, try and make the thread take a different direction or simply abandon the thread (as you have done with several others like this).

C'mon, just provide one bit of evidence that Secure Boot is Anti Theft because nothing I can find online states anything about anti theft.  The definition of Secure Boot from http://blogs.technet.com/b/home_is_where_i_lay_my_head/archive/2013/09/18/enabling-secure-boot-in-windows-8.aspx is:
Quote
Secure Boot is a feature on UEFI-based PCs that helps increase the security of a PC by preventing unauthorized software from running on a PC during the boot sequence. It checks that each piece of software has a valid signature, including the operating system that will be loaded.
Now, if you want to dispute this definition, then provide evidence against it!

Now, to go back onto your claim that "Secure Boot is not easy to disable" - This image shows the BIOS/UEFI setup utility on my laptop, look how simple it is to disable, just one option!

BC_Programmer


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Re: Do not Put Linux on a New Laptop
« Reply #31 on: August 18, 2014, 04:51:05 PM »
BC did that with his absurd assertion that Computrace did not exist and no computers had it.
heh, I never made that assertion. CompuTrace wasn't even mentioned.

You said and repeatedly made implications that Secure Boot was for preventing laptop theft. You never Once in this thread said anything about CompuTrace, a completely different technology. CompuTrace is a feature in the BIOS. It has nothing to do with how the system is booted, and is used for asset tracking as well as theft recovery. The "agent" Software is in the BIOS; once enabled it cannot be disabled and the Agent will install silently into the OS from there.

At no point does CompuTrace nor SecureBoot cross paths. Disabling SecureBoot does NOT disable CompuTrace.
I was trying to dereference Null Pointers before it was cool.

camerongray



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Re: Do not Put Linux on a New Laptop
« Reply #32 on: August 18, 2014, 04:52:47 PM »
Wow I totally missed that, speechless!  ::)

Computrace and Secure Boot both exist yet are totally different things!  Secure Boot is not Anti Theft, CompuTrace is.

The entire point of Tux2's post was to show that CompuTrace is totally separate from Secure Boot.

mmulin



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    Re: Do not Put Linux on a New Laptop
    « Reply #33 on: November 10, 2014, 09:28:18 PM »
    Geek-9PM: Here you go. This is from the official UEFI forum. This document discusses common misconceptions about secure boot:
    http://www.uefi.org/sites/default/files/resources/UEFI_Secure_Boot_in_Modern_Computer_Security_Solutions_2013.pdf

    Excerpt:
    What is UEFI Secure Boot, and how did it originate?
    UEFI Secure Boot was created to enhance security in the pre-boot environment. UEFI Forum members developed
    the UEFI specification, an interface framework that affords firmware, operating system and hardware providers a
    defense against potential malware attacks. Without UEFI Secure Boot, malware developers can more easily take
    advantage of several pre-boot attack points, including the system-embedded firmware itself, as well as the interval
    between the firmware initiation and the loading of the operating system. Malware inserted at this point can
    provide an environment in which an operating system—no matter how secure—cannot run safely. Secure Boot
    helps firmware, operating system and hardware providers cooperate to thwart the efforts of malware developers.
    Additional background on the intent of UEFI Secure Boot can be found in "UEFI Networking and Pre-OS
    Security," published in the Intel Technology Journal [1].

    What are the most common misperceptions about UEFI and UEFI Secure Boot?
    Several misperceptions about UEFI Secure Boot, its intended uses, requirements and application exist within the
    technology and end-user community. A few of the most common are outlined below and in greater depth
    throughout this paper.
    - False: “UEFI Secure Boot is an attempt to ‘lock’ platforms to software from specific vendors and block
    operating systems and software from others.”
    - False: “UEFI Secure Boot requires a TPM chip, as described by the Trusted Computing Group (TCG), and
    TCG controls the UEFI specification.”
    - False: “UEFI Secure Boot requires a specific implementation by computer manufacturers and operating
    system vendors.”

    Additionally, from my experience, if it is anything worth to you, I like to give you this for a thought. I am C3iO for a tech company which maintains a laptop user base of roughly 1200 machines. By our company policy, we will reimburse, within boundaries, each user's laptop and OS purchase, instead of the company forcing one onto them, as long they are able to support the Unix/ Linux based work environment (yes, even Windows laptops are welcome). By current count, 68% are Linux/ Unix installations, the rest being MacOS or Windows. 97% of all have been purchased within the last two years and those, if not Macs, came all with UEFI & secure boot as default settings.
    All have been reinstalled, since we do not allow factory installs. The variety is across the board; Asus, Lenovo, Samsung, Dell, you name it.. The number of laptops we could not reinstall with a different OS is 0 (zero) !

    Geek-9PM, whatever you read on the internet and apparently believe, is not supported by any official documentation, nor reality. I know their have been scare reports and confusion in the early days of secure boot announcements until their-of clarification. I urge you to show me any laptop (not RT, tablet, or army spec model) on sale these days, which can not install any compatible OS (I mean HW compatible OS, not secure boot compatible!) on it by means of disabling secure boot or enabling legacy boot (for a non-UEFI OS).
    Also, as an advise towards efficiency, you are perhaps being better off by maintaining a list of unsupported machines.

    Geek-9pm

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    Re: Do not Put Linux on a New Laptop
    « Reply #34 on: November 10, 2014, 11:26:59 PM »
    mmulin, thank you for the post.  Glad to hear from somebody active in the industry and can speak with authority.

    BC_Programmer


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    Re: Do not Put Linux on a New Laptop
    « Reply #35 on: November 10, 2014, 11:33:05 PM »
    mmulin, thank you for the post.  Glad to hear from somebody active in the industry and can speak with authority.

    Excellently done passive aggressiveness there. I guess you have to save face somehow.
    I was trying to dereference Null Pointers before it was cool.

    mmulin



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      Re: Do not Put Linux on a New Laptop
      « Reply #36 on: November 13, 2014, 08:56:00 PM »

      camerongray



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      Re: Do not Put Linux on a New Laptop
      « Reply #37 on: November 14, 2014, 06:42:42 PM »