Can 24 computers be networked to one PC?

[dmm@ras]

Is it possible to turn one computer into a server and network 24 computers to it?
All computers are running Windows XP pro, SP2.
I either heard or read that with this OS you can only have a max of 10 computers in one workgroup, is this true?
When you have a server, is this considered a "domain"? and if so, can a pc act as a server/domain?

[nixxon]

If you get a server (win server 2k or 2k3, Linux) then you can add an active directory to create a Domain which you can join 23+ computers to.

[viking]

To create a computer network you need a 24 ports switch (your case). Better 2 switches that combined will have more than 26 ports.
The 10 computers rule is: no more than 10 computers can connect to another computer with Windows, if the computer with Windows is not a Server version. You can have workgroups of tens of computers, it's ok. It's just no more than 10 computers can connect to other computer if that one does not have a Windows Server version. Also, in enterprise medium, it is not advisable to have large workgroups because of computer administration problems. When everyone watches for his computer, there will be users that know to properly work and administrate their computer and users that don't know much about computer administration. In case of large workgroups the sugestion is to buy a Windows Server and client access licences (there are 2 cases of client access licences, I will not explain further) and set up a windows active directory. After that you need a network administrator that will centralize the network administration, the other users will have only to work and will not be bothered by computer and network administration.
You can have a server without being part of a windows domain.
It does not matter if it is a pc or a super computer acting as a "server".
The server is the computer that has the data which should be shared to another computer (hence, the server role changes according to situation), the client computer is the computer that needs the data from another computer (from "server").

What you said with workgroup biger than 10 computers not allowed is false.
What do you want to do?

[dmm@ras]

Wow! Great information. Thank you for sharing. All computers at present are networked via a 20 port Cisco switch. Given that this network is being done on a shoestring, we do not have the resources to (ideally) purchase Windows Server & client access licenses. You mention there could be workgroups of tens of computers which leads to my next question. Can the computer we are using that is acting as a server (Teacher computer) be part of more than one workgroup? The Teacher computer is where the security dongle is attached for authorized/unlocked test administrations. And there is another computer based program installed on a flash drive connected to the Teacher computer where data is accessed and written. So, all 24 computers ultimately must access the Teacher computer when either of the computer based testing programs are being administered. Right now we are having to alternate computers (reading & listening tests) to not exceed the 10 simultaneous connections to the Teacher computer for reading tests. I realize a server is the best option, it's just not an option for our school at present.

[viking]

Only one workgroup. Only 10 concurrent connections for any Windows XP.

I don't recall exactly, but if I remember well, if you are using an administrator account you may have more than 10 simultaneous connections to "server". This is a dangerous option, the local administrator account has complete rights over the computer (local administrator account for that server I mean).

To solve you problem, you may try to use a proxy program. Or a NAT server (it's the same thing for your problem) like ICS. Other NAT servers... You may use some Linux options. You may use some proxy servers for free. I will mention one proxy server that is simple to set up: Jana Server. But you may find others.

This adds some complication to your network... But you may try it. I do not know what application do you use for reading and listening, what type of files do you use. You will have to use 2 different subnets. Better 2 different networks, let's say 192.168.2 and 192.168.3. I reffer to logical networks, not physiscal networks. Your cabling solution doesn't change much, you will need 1 more network card and a cross over cable (I assume you have an Ethernet network). But you will change some IPs, you will install a proxy server/NAT server (in linux it's a "masquerading" server).

Do you have some computers network knowledge?  IPs, networks, subnet masks? You will have to put 2 network cards in a computer; you will assign IPs for 2 different networks, you will install a proxy server or you will activate ICS on that computer. The Teacher computer has to have internet access? The other computers in network? This further complicates my "sollution".

The costs? A free proxy server (hence 0 price) or ICS (already included with Windows), a cross over cable (a few bucks) and a new computer network card (another few bucks). You will solve the problem with 30 dollars, if the application you use supports NAT traversal or using a proxy server.
But... I need more details before I will explain further.
So: what application do you use? What are the network requirements for the networked computers? Internet access on all of them? They ar part of a greater computer network?

Another simple sollution, which involves NAT, is to use a router. I will tell you further if I find more information from you. It's too large the subject, and I would not like to write here things that won't help you. I have to look forward to see if any type of connection is counted for that 10 limit. I know about network browsing, but I am not sure that any type of connection will add.

[Later edit] Any tcp/udp connection will add . I'm reading further. [/Later edit]

[dmm@ras]

Hello! and thank you for your detailed response/reply. I'd like to answer some of your questions...the assessment center is independently networked from our school's LAN and has no Internet connection. It is completely "stand-alone," so to speak. Therefore, without Internet access, the proxy server idea while a good one will not work for this set-up.

At present, all computers are running Windows XPpro, SP2. They are networked with Cat 5 Ethernet cables using a Cisco 20 port switch. I will add a 4 port hub to complete networking all 24 computers. The primary software application used for administering the assessments is written using SQL Server Express Edition which establishes the client/server relationship without much effort.

I realize all computers can be considered within the same workgroup, however, only 10 at any one given time can have simultaneous connection to the host computer. At this point, I believe we will have to endure the expense and purchase a server application program, such as Windows 2000 Server. I came across one over eBay that includes 25 CALs for a little over $200. Someone also mentioned Windows Standard Server Edition and that it only costs about $80, but the information I found on it was that it only supports up to 4 CPUs on one server. Am I not understanding correctly?

In any case, I have learned allot from everyone while trying to arrive at the best arrangement to serve our needs and fit our pocketbook. If you have any other suggestions/recommendations, I am always open for more!

[Raptor]

Are you from Holland?

[dmm@ras]

Interesting question/reply. The answer is no.....not sure why you asked. In any case, I am just trying to accomplish a task without a great deal of expense. However, it is looking more and more like we will have to purchase a server application program to enable all 24 computers to connect simultaneously to the host/teacher computer station.

[viking]

If you buy a Windows Server version, all 24 computers will be able to connect to the computer on which you installed the Windows Server. On any computer that has Windows XP installed, the 10 connections limit remains. So, some tickling with the settings will need to be made for that application. Most probably the "teacher's" computer will be the server, with Windows Server operating system on it. It depends on the application used, it depends if it is well documented and presents that case in documentation or not.
You need to buy a switch (avoid hubs) with at least 6 ports. Why? Because you have to connect those 2 switches, and so one port on each switch will be needed to connect the 2. 1 port on Cisco + 1 port on the other = 2 ports; you need 24 ports for computers => 24+2 it's the minimum number of ports you need to have. My advice? Buy a switch with at least 8 ports, better 16, ideally 24. Diference of price between 8-16-24? Minuscule. Not able to see it with bare eye Personally, I would go with a 16 switch port.

Why are you disturbed by the 4 processor restriction? You won't buy such a server (hardware) anyway, it is very-very expensive, it's price starts at a few thousands dollars/euro. That restriction applies for the number of processors that the local machine has (the computer on which you will install the Windows Server version), it does not matter how many computers will connect by network to it and how many processors do they have.

[dmm@ras]

OK, a server it is. The principal has agreed to purchase MS Windows 2000 Server with the needed 24 client access licenses (CALs). I was not aware that we could acquire this product at an educational cost for as little as $80 and a little over $5 per CAL. So for just over $200, our problem is solved with the exception of adding the additional switch, or 2 hubs to complete the 24 networked computers.

Thank you again for all your help. I have learned allot!

[viking]

Maybe I was not clear with a thing: AVOID HUBS!!! BUY A SWITCH OR 2. PLEASE AVOID HUBS!!!

[Sid]

Maybe I was not clear with a thing: AVOID HUBS!!! BUY A SWITCH OR 2. PLEASE AVOID HUBS!!!

Just out of curiosity...why?

[Raptor]

Maybe I was not clear with a thing: AVOID HUBS!!! BUY A SWITCH OR 2. PLEASE AVOID HUBS!!!

Just out of curiosity...why?

Hubs cause collisions, switches do not.