yes which is why they were probably so inexpensive at the time. I had a devil of a time trying to get them to work--i think it was one of my earliest posts for help on the CH forums. Finally talked to a company in Australia ( a very long way from where i am)--they had the same name--and they made the pin suggestion change to "cable select"-which got them working. I wonder how our O/P is making out ? Thanks for the input. truenorth