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Author Topic: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP  (Read 17980 times)

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ossilix

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    Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
    « on: July 28, 2010, 10:59:20 PM »
    My computer runs Windows XP Home Edition Service Pack 2. It was custom-built in 2002 with some upgrades in 2005. (It's not a brand name off-the-shelf.) Here is some info from Belarc Advisor:

    System Model:
    VIA Technologies, Inc. VT8366-8233/5
    Enclosure Type: Desktop

    Processor:
    2.00 gigahertz AMD Athlon XP
    128 kilobyte primary memory cache
    256 kilobyte secondary memory cache
    Not hyper-threaded         

    Main Circuit Board:
    Board: VT8366-8233/5
    Bus Clock: 133 megahertz
    BIOS: Phoenix Technologies, LTD 6.00 PG 06/20/2002

    It is not listed in Belarc but the motherboard is Chaintech Apogee 7VJL.

    I have the original WIndows XP home edition CD that came with the computer. I can't find the discs that came with the motherboard, I think they may not have given them to me.

    I was getting ready to finally install Windows XP SP3 (after putting it off for a long time) but began discovering problems.

    The hard drive is a 120gb Samsung SP1203 IDE Hard Drive that I have been using for 5 years. I ran the Samsung diagnostic tool HUTIL on it, and all of the tests said "PASS" until the final one, Read Surface Scan which said this:

    C:1267 H:1 S:715 Error: ECC Error
    C:1268 H:1 S:687 Error: ECC Error
    Error: This drive has some defects

    And it said "recommend to do Erase HDD".

    I don't know what an ECC Error is (couldn't find a straight answer on Google) but I assume it means my hard drive is failing.

    Do I need to stop using the computer immediately? Is there anything I can do to keep it going? Would running ChkDsk /f /r help? What is an ECC error and how serious is it?

    I do backup my important data to an external hard drive regularly.

    I use this computer for many things and it works great, I never have any problems with it until recently when my Windows XP startup/shutdown began exhibiting a long lag time, which is how this problem came to light. I don't know if this problem is causing the slow startup/shutdown, but I suspect it's not related.

    I know my computer is very old but I just can't afford to buy a new one now and need to save this one if possible.

    I could run the Erase HDD thing hoping that it will fix the problem then reinstall everything, but I doubt it would work. Even if it did I'm concerned that I will never be able to get all of the hardware and software I have working again (especially the Soundblaster Audigy sound card with a special front hub with audio inputs on it that I need to be able to use).

    I know very little about computer hardware. The only other option I can find is to install a new hard drive. But my motherboard (being so old) works only with IDE hard drives, which after searching I realize are hard to find since everything is SATA now. Would it be possible to use a SATA to IDE converter, or SATA controller card, to be able to use a SATA hard drive in my computer? Or is the motherboard too old for that to even work?

    Any advice anyone can give me would be very helpful, I really can't lose this computer. :-(

    DaveLembke



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    Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
    « Reply #1 on: July 28, 2010, 11:51:09 PM »
    Instead of a SATA to IDE converter, I'd just pick up a PCI SATA controller and upgrade the system to SATA. The SATA controller cards are not very expensive, usually around $20-$30

    I wouldnt take any chances with a hard drive that fails diagnostics unless the system is used for unimportant purposes. Usually when a drive is dying you will get a S.M.A.R.T error message, although its not uncommon for a drive to die without warning as well.

    ossilix

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      Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
      « Reply #2 on: July 29, 2010, 12:14:34 AM »
      Dave, do you think that the rest of my system isn't so old that it's not worth trying to fix it? Would a PCI SATA card work with my motherboard etc?

      Also would it be possible to keep the existing IDE hard drive installed as a secondary internal drive along with a new SATA one?

      EDIT: My motherboard is very old, and Chaintech's website doesn't have drivers for their motherboards (they don't make motherboards anymore). Even if it did I don't think they ever had SATA drivers for this board. Since I can't get a SATA driver for my motherboard, does that mean I can't use a SATA hard drive even if I get a SATA PCI controller card? Especially since I need to use the SATA drive as the primary drive?
      « Last Edit: July 29, 2010, 01:14:21 AM by ossilix »

      ossilix

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        Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
        « Reply #3 on: July 29, 2010, 03:18:13 AM »
        Should I run chkdsk /f /r? Is there a chance that will make the problem worse?

        Computer_Commando



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        Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
        « Reply #4 on: July 29, 2010, 11:54:01 AM »
        Should I run chkdsk /f /r? Is there a chance that will make the problem worse?
        Yes, run it, won't hurt it at all.  It won't run while Windows is running but on the next reboot, if you answer "yes".

        I had no problems with this card in a 10-year old P-III.
        http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816132009&cm_re=sata_pci_card-_-16-132-009-_-Product

        Allan

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        Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
        « Reply #5 on: July 29, 2010, 12:16:33 PM »
        Should I run chkdsk /f /r? Is there a chance that will make the problem worse?
        The command is chkdsk /r (drop the /f switch). And you should run it from the Recovery Console.

        Computer_Commando



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        Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
        « Reply #6 on: July 29, 2010, 12:31:50 PM »
        My computer runs Windows XP Home Edition Service Pack 2...
        BTW, support has ended for SP2.

        ossilix

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          Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
          « Reply #7 on: July 29, 2010, 12:57:58 PM »
          I had no problems with this card in a 10-year old P-III.
          http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16816132009&cm_re=sata_pci_card-_-16-132-009-_-Product

          Did you use it to install a SATA drive as the primary drive? I couldn't find any SATA cards that were bootable and that one doesn't mention if it is or not.

          BTW I think I would rather just get an IDE drive if it will avoid any problems. I posted about that here: http://www.computerhope.com/forum/index.php/topic,108076.0.html

          ossilix

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            Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
            « Reply #8 on: July 29, 2010, 12:58:59 PM »
            BTW, support has ended for SP2.

            Yes I know, I was getting ready to install SP3 when I discovered the errors on the hard drive.  :( I shouldn't install SP3 on this drive now that it's got errors, right?

            Computer_Commando



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            Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
            « Reply #9 on: July 29, 2010, 02:48:39 PM »
            ... I shouldn't install SP3 on this drive now that it's got errors, right?
            Right.
            You can test the hard drive with the drive manufacturer's software.  It can usually correct any errors that Windows can't correct.
            http://www.tacktech.com/display.cfm?ttid=287

            ossilix

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              Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
              « Reply #10 on: July 29, 2010, 05:12:50 PM »
              Quote from: Computer_Commando
              You can test the hard drive with the drive manufacturer's software.  It can usually correct any errors that Windows can't correct.
              http://www.tacktech.com/display.cfm?ttid=287

              Thanks - I did run the Samsung diagnostic, that's how I knew there was a problem. The only option it offered was to erase the hard drive, no guarantee that it would fix the problem. I'd rather try installing a new drive first, in case the new drive doesn't work at least I'll have something to fall back on until i can figure something else out.

              Computer_Commando



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              Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
              « Reply #11 on: July 29, 2010, 05:22:50 PM »
              There is other diagnostic software that will probably fix the drive, but at $100, it's not worth it to you.
              http://www.grc.com/sr/spinrite.htm

              Allan

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              Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
              « Reply #12 on: July 30, 2010, 05:49:08 AM »
              There is other diagnostic software that will probably fix the drive, but at $100, it's not worth it to you.
              http://www.grc.com/sr/spinrite.htm
              Wow. The drive is shot. Replace it. Next.

              ossilix

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                Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                « Reply #13 on: July 31, 2010, 01:59:55 PM »
                Quote from: Allan
                Wow. The drive is shot. Replace it. Next.

                What specifically makes you say that? I am trying to replace it - do you think I have enough time to be able to do it thoughtfully or should I just do it as fast as possible?

                Allan

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                Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                « Reply #14 on: July 31, 2010, 02:06:55 PM »
                Your drive is failing the diagnostic tests. Copy critical data and replace it. Or don't - it's up to you.

                ossilix

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                  Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                  « Reply #15 on: July 31, 2010, 03:45:54 PM »
                  Your drive is failing the diagnostic tests. Copy critical data and replace it. Or don't - it's up to you.

                  I already have backups of my critical data, and am currently trying to find a new drive and good method of cloning or whatever so I can replace this one. But I would like to take the time to do it correctly, rather than risking messing up the computer worse by trying to hurry, running out right now and grabbing the first drive I see or following the first set of directions I find only to discover that they won't work and I'm stuck with no computer at all. What I'm asking is, do you think I have time to do that? I'm hoping to get this taken care of by the end of this week (preferably sooner), I don't mean a month from now or something like that.

                  Allan

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                  Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                  « Reply #16 on: July 31, 2010, 03:50:54 PM »
                  There's no way to know. The drive can die in five minutes or five months. And don't overthink getting a new drive - it's just not that big of a deal.

                  ossilix

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                    Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                    « Reply #17 on: July 31, 2010, 05:26:11 PM »
                    There's no way to know. The drive can die in five minutes or five months. And don't overthink getting a new drive - it's just not that big of a deal.

                    I think it's a big deal if I get a drive that's incompatible with my system (137gb limit) and it somehow fries the rest of the hardware, or if I can't use the disk I get and end up not being able to switch back to the one I have now, or to not be able to install Windows, or a bunch of other things that could go wrong. I want to make sure I know exactly what I'm doing so I don't screw it up.

                    Computer_Commando



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                    Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                    « Reply #18 on: July 31, 2010, 06:09:42 PM »
                    I think it's a big deal...
                    Format it & reinstall Windows & see if that will fix it for you.  That's your only options short of buying a new drive.

                    ossilix

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                      Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                      « Reply #19 on: August 01, 2010, 03:50:17 PM »
                      Quote from: Computer_Commando
                      Format it & reinstall Windows & see if that will fix it for you.  That's your only options short of buying a new drive.

                      Actually I've already made up my mind that I need to get a new drive, so that's okay. If I format this one I lose everything; if I can't get Windows to reinstall of the drive fails at that point, I have no computer. At least if I get a new drive and clone this one to it or fresh install I might be able to switch back to the old drive if something goes wrong.

                      Allan

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                      Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                      « Reply #20 on: August 01, 2010, 04:02:46 PM »
                      I think it's a big deal if I get a drive that's incompatible with my system (137gb limit) and it somehow fries the rest of the hardware, or if I can't use the disk I get and end up not being able to switch back to the one I have now, or to not be able to install Windows, or a bunch of other things that could go wrong. I want to make sure I know exactly what I'm doing so I don't screw it up.
                      First of all, you can partition your drive any way you want and use as large a drive as you like. Second, a hd cannot "fry" your hardware. I wasn't being flip - it's not a big deal - though you are certainly trying to make it one.

                      Format it & reinstall Windows & see if that will fix it for you.  That's your only options short of buying a new drive.
                      THE DRIVE IS FAILING THE DIAGNOSTICS. How does formatting and reinstalling the OS fix that?

                      ossilix

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                        Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                        « Reply #21 on: August 01, 2010, 09:34:00 PM »
                        First of all, you can partition your drive any way you want and use as large a drive as you like. Second, a hd cannot "fry" your hardware. I wasn't being flip - it's not a big deal - though you are certainly trying to make it one.

                        Sorry - I'm kind of on edge, it's scary when something goes wrong with your computer and you don't know what to do.  :'( Doing something like the really is a big deal to me, because I've never done it before.

                        About the HD size though, I can't just pop in a 500gb drive because my BIOS may only be able to access 137gb. I'm hoping if I put Windows on a partition smaller than that it will help avoid any problems with data loss etc.


                        Quote
                        THE DRIVE IS FAILING THE DIAGNOSTICS. How does formatting and reinstalling the OS fix that?

                        Yeah - I'm not going to try to fix this disk, it's 5 years old with errors on it... Just trying to figur eout the best route to replacing it with a new one.

                        Allan

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                        Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                        « Reply #22 on: August 02, 2010, 05:45:01 AM »
                        Again, with almost any bios you can use a larger drive, just create partitions smaller than 137Gb (which is smart to do anyway.)

                        Also, see if there is a bios upgrade available for your system. That could solve the whole 137Gb limitation problem.

                        Computer_Commando



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                        Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                        « Reply #23 on: August 02, 2010, 11:25:03 AM »
                        ECC errors can usually be fixed by formatting the drive.  That's what the diagnostic told him to do.  This happened to me a couple days ago on a Seagate notebook drive.  Diagnostics passed, formatted drive, problem solved.

                        ossilix

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                          Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                          « Reply #24 on: August 02, 2010, 02:19:23 PM »
                          Again, with almost any bios you can use a larger drive, just create partitions smaller than 137Gb (which is smart to do anyway.)

                          Also, see if there is a bios upgrade available for your system. That could solve the whole 137Gb limitation problem.

                          I'd feel safer just leaving the BIOS the way it is and partitioning the drive. Now that I've read more about partitioning I see what you mean about it being a good idea anyway.

                          Truthfully I'm not even positive the BIOS won't see the whole drive, but my mobo is from 2001 (right around the time the 48-it addressing thing started happening) so I'm assuming it won't (manual doesn't say anything about it) and going for the contingency plan. If it does end up seeing the whole thing that's just a bonus I guess!

                          ECC errors can usually be fixed by formatting the drive.  That's what the diagnostic told him to do.  This happened to me a couple days ago on a Seagate notebook drive.  Diagnostics passed, formatted drive, problem solved.

                          Yes, but like I said if I format it I lose everything. I already got the new drive and I'm working up the courage to try a fresh XP install on it, but knowing I have the old drive to fall back on if I need to is a security blanket. I could always try formatting the old drive once I get the new one working so I can keep using it as a second drive right? And then if it just fails at least I would be up and running.

                          BTW thank you for the input guys

                          Allan

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                          Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                          « Reply #25 on: August 02, 2010, 02:34:14 PM »
                          You're welcome. But if your bios is the original release from 2001 you really should update it.

                          ossilix

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                            Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                            « Reply #26 on: August 02, 2010, 07:30:39 PM »
                            You're welcome. But if your bios is the original release from 2001 you really should update it.

                            I can't, there isn't an update for it. The company (Chaintech) doesn't make motherboards anymore, doesn't support their old ones and doesn't have anything available for them on their website.  >:(

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                            Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                            « Reply #27 on: August 03, 2010, 09:14:53 AM »
                            I can't just pop in a 500gb drive

                            Yes you can. wether your BIOS recognizes the entire thing isn't really relevant. Wether yo uget a new 80GB or a 500GB, it's going to be better then what you already have because the drive you have is failing. If you don't get your data off of it, it's  gone. You have no way of knowing exactly <when> it will go ,but in my experience there is no set method in which they go. as Allan said- it can pretty much die anytime. The point is; what if it dies while your agonizing over the details of your new drive and presenting theories on you BIOS limitations? Then it won't really matter much, will it.

                            Partition size is completely out of context as far as the BIOS is concerned. of the 137GB limit is anything like the ~32GB limit, BIOS's may simply freeze at startup, or when it attempts to access the drive. Thankfully, almost all IDE drives have cylinder reduction jumper settings to 32GB and 137GB so aside from wasted space your agonizing over a non issue. Installing a drive isn't going to fry your computer except in the very rarest of circumstances, and if you're going to worry about that, you better start worrying about getting hit by lightning on a clear sunny day, or that one day you'll walk outside your house and be attacked by a naked midget with a bazooka. Same chances.

                            Lastly: you've only referred to the motherboard as "motherboard from 2001" and other rather vague indications. Can you give the entire model number so <we> can actually research for the relevant information too? (that is, wether it can work with 48-bit addressing,BIOS update availability, etc)



                            I was trying to dereference Null Pointers before it was cool.

                            truenorth



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                              Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                              « Reply #28 on: August 03, 2010, 09:36:42 AM »
                              To address your concern (very valid in my opinion) of the difficulties that may arise from reformatting or installing a "replacement" HDD in that computer may i suggest the following. Though i have never used one apparently software programs exist that will backup (to your medium of choice) the current drivers associated with your computer. Then they can be reinstalled on the formatted or new HDD and will duplicate precisely the drivers that were there previously and supposedly eliminate the problems associated with otherwise lost drivers that you might have difficulty finding. Or even know what is missing. There was one offered very recently on the "giveawayoftheday" web site. However i cannot remember which one of the many that are in their archive that it was. Maybe another member might remember or have a specific recommendation in that area. Here is the link to the site that lists a number of those type of programs.
                              http://www.giveawayoftheday.com/search_soft/?string=driver+backup&x=53&y=18
                              I hope this will assist you to resolve your problem with as little problem as possible. good luck,truenorth

                              ossilix

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                                Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                                « Reply #29 on: August 03, 2010, 02:29:23 PM »
                                Yes you can. wether your BIOS recognizes the entire thing isn't really relevant.

                                I read in several places (including Microsoft's site) that if you use a HDD larger than 137gb on a system that doesn't support 48-bit addressing you would lose data and Windows would eventually become corrupted. But I think that's referring to both the BIOS _and_ Windows XP. If that's the case, since I have SP1 (with 48-bit addressing) it isn't an issue.

                                After all this, I'm starting to realize (more than I already did) that 99% of people on message boards don't know what they're talking about. I've been told a million different things with no backup whatsoever.

                                Logically I assume if Windows can't access anything past 137gb on the drive (by installing it on a smaller partition) it can't put any important information in a space where the BIOS can't get to it, which means BIOS will never have a problem loading Windows. And if, while using Windows, the partition gets full, it would just say "Hey this disk is full", it won't automatically wrap around to the beginning and start overwriting files there like people say it will if you don't have 48-bit addressing and don't partition the hard drive to smaller size, or start writing to another partition on the drive and overwrite files there.

                                Quote
                                Wether yo uget a new 80GB or a 500GB, it's going to be better then what you already have because the drive you have is failing. If you don't get your data off of it, it's  gone.

                                All my data is already backed up (most twice, some of it three times).

                                Quote
                                The point is; what if it dies while your agonizing over the details of your new drive and presenting theories on you BIOS limitations? Then it won't really matter much, will it.

                                What if I just went and did it, and messed it up worse because I didn't know what I was doing? ;)

                                Quote
                                Installing a drive isn't going to fry your computer except in the very rarest of circumstances, and if you're going to worry about that, you better start worrying about getting hit by lightning on a clear sunny day, or that one day you'll walk outside your house and be attacked by a naked midget with a bazooka. Same chances.

                                LOL

                                Quote
                                Lastly: you've only referred to the motherboard as "motherboard from 2001" and other rather vague indications. Can you give the entire model number so <we> can actually research for the relevant information too? (that is, wether it can work with 48-bit addressing,BIOS update availability, etc)

                                It's Chaintech Apogee 7VJL. if you can find any info that would be great, but I and other people have looked and not found any. As I said, Chaintech doesn't do motherboards anymore, doesn't have any info for them on their site, and doesn't respond to messages about them. Archive.org has some of the drivers that were available on the site before they removed that section, but there' no way I'm going install new drivers haphazardly just to see what they do.

                                In any event, I did buy the 500gb drive on Sunday, installed it yesterday (well, plugged the cables from the old drive into the new drive and left the new one sitting on the bottom of the computer enclosure so I can switch back if I need to) and clean installed Windows XP on a 120gb partition. (The cloning process failed because of sector read errors so I gave up on it.) Not surprisingly, the motherboard only sees 136gb of the new drive, but Windows does load fine. Started installing some hardware (sound card is working) but now I can't get the network connections working. I will have to post a new message to see if anyone has input on that.

                                In the meantime I've switched back to the old drive so I can try to get some help. I'm posting this message from the old drive, so thankfully it was correct that you can just plug the old drive back in and go back to what you have before.

                                BTW I do understand what you're saying about overthinking the process, but I'm not some computer tech guy who's familiar with these things. I've never even installed Windows myself before, let alone installing a new hard drive--I didn't know anything about formatting and partitioning--and before I could do it I needed to find out as much information as possible so make sure I didn't do something wrong. I didn't know anything about any of this it until a few days ago. It's a lot of information to absorb in a short time and I needed second opinions.

                                ossilix

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                                  Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                                  « Reply #30 on: August 03, 2010, 02:31:32 PM »
                                  To address your concern (very valid in my opinion) of the difficulties that may arise from reformatting or installing a "replacement" HDD in that computer may i suggest the following.

                                  Thank you Truenorth! I will definitely look into that! And thank you for backing me up in believing this was worth researching thoroughly before doing anything.

                                  Allan

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                                  Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                                  « Reply #31 on: August 03, 2010, 02:49:43 PM »
                                  1) After installing the OS did you install the chipset drivers? If not, they should be the first drivers installed.

                                  2) Go ahead and create other partitions on the drive so you can utilize the entire 500 Gb.

                                  BC_Programmer


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                                  Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                                  « Reply #32 on: August 03, 2010, 03:09:17 PM »
                                  I read in several places (including Microsoft's site) that if you use a HDD larger than 137gb on a system that doesn't support 48-bit addressing you would lose data and Windows would eventually become corrupted. But I think that's referring to both the BIOS _and_ Windows XP. If that's the case, since I have SP1 (with 48-bit addressing) it isn't an issue.

                                  If the BIOS doesn't support 48-bit LBA, you aren't going to be able to access >137GB of data, and the drive itself will be recognized, if at all, as 137GB. the issue you've researched and the data you've found appears to be a mishmash of possible behaviour resulting from XP  before SP1a as well as implementation dependent BIOS issues. as you note you have SP1 so the OS issue (the one that the KB article cites as causing data loss) isn't a problem.

                                  Quote
                                  Logically I assume if Windows can't access anything past 137gb on the drive (by installing it on a smaller partition) it can't put any important information in a space where the BIOS can't get to it, which means BIOS will never have a problem loading Windows. And if, while using Windows, the partition gets full, it would just say "Hey this disk is full", it won't automatically wrap around to the beginning and start overwriting files there like people say it will if you don't have 48-bit addressing and don't partition the hard drive to smaller size, or start writing to another partition on the drive and overwrite files there.

                                  If the BIOS is limited to 28-bit addressing, then it is fully possible for software that is unaware that the BIOS is limited in this fashion to add to a near maximum value; the OS value is still correct, but when the OS sends this to the BIOS, the BIOS only uses the first 28 bits of the 48-bit value. (or maybe it was the last bits, not sure, it's probably implementation specific). therefore, the address that the BIOS actually writes data and where the OS told the BIOS to write data don't match.

                                  Corruption is the result. That of course only results if you are able to partition a drive larger then 137GB (not sure how one would do that, again, depends on the BIOS and specific implementation details)

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                                  It's Chaintech Apogee 7VJL. if you can find any info that would be great,


                                  I think I Found some:

                                  Quote
                                  Supports two IDE ports up to 4 ATAPI devices
                                  Supports PIO Mode 4 up to 16.6MBps, Multi Mode 4 up to
                                  66MBps, Multi Word Mode 5 up to 100MBps and Multi Word Mode
                                  6 up to 133MBps with Bus Mastering

                                  It supports ATA-6(100mbps), and ATA-7(133mbps) With Bus mastering. since ATA-6 is the 48-bit LBA "fix" introduced by Maxtor, you should be fine. I might have failed in my google and wound up with a page for a different model though- this is where I got that info:

                                  http://www.overclockersonline.net/reviews/5000156/

                                  Given that you are still only seeing 136GB, I don't know why. I've always figured if something has ATA-6 it's past the standard, but then again, I've seen weird stuff. my ancient K6-2 (1998-1999 or so) recognizes a 160GB drive with no problem on the secondary channel... (but not as the primary channel, oddly enough), so there's always room for a little mystery. (why does it recognize past not just the 32.7 GB barrier of the BIOS itself but the <LATER> barrier of 137GB being the big one for me).

                                  Quote
                                  BTW I do understand what you're saying about overthinking the process, but I'm not some computer tech guy
                                  who's familiar with these things. I've never even installed Windows myself before, let alone installing a new hard drive--I didn't know anything about formatting and partitioning--and before I could do it I needed to find out as much information as possible so make sure I didn't do something wrong. I didn't know anything about any of this it until a few days ago. It's a lot of information to absorb in a short time and I needed second opinions.
                                  Very true, and I do apologize for any offense or frustration I may have caused. I was under the impression that your data was wasting away while you sat and decided what to do, but if you indeed had your data backed up (perhaps I missed it mentioned before in my rush to express my self-import, heh) then it would be fine to take ones time.
                                  I was trying to dereference Null Pointers before it was cool.

                                  truenorth



                                    Guru

                                    Thanked: 253
                                    Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                                    « Reply #33 on: August 03, 2010, 04:36:11 PM »
                                    I went back and found the actual "giveawayoftheday" that moderator "Allan" had provided a few days ago.While this particular one has expired (as to being free) it will fully explain what it does.It may be available free elsewhere as offers from that site are often available from other locations.
                                    "Giveaway of the Day - Driver Magician 3.5
                                    « on: July 29, 2010, 02:14:49 PM »   

                                    Driver Magician offers a professional solution for device drivers backup, restoration, update and removal in Windows operating system. It identifies all the hardware in the system, extracts their associated drivers from the hard disk and backs them up to a location of your choice. Then when you format and reinstall/upgrade your operating system, you can restore all the “saved” drivers just as if you had the original driver diskettes in your hands. After one system reboot, your PC will be loaded and running with the required hardware drivers.

                                    http://www.giveawayoftheday.com/
                                    truenorth

                                    ossilix

                                      Topic Starter


                                      Rookie

                                      Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                                      « Reply #34 on: August 03, 2010, 06:38:19 PM »
                                      1) After installing the OS did you install the chipset drivers? If not, they should be the first drivers installed.

                                      Does Windows XP not already include drivers for the chipset? How can I check to see if they're already installed?

                                      What would happen if the chipset drivers weren't installed, would it cause obvious problems? I used the new installation for a while and didn't notice any problems other than the D-Link ethernet adapter saying a cable was unplugged.

                                      Quote
                                      2) Go ahead and create other partitions on the drive so you can utilize the entire 500 Gb.

                                      I'm going to wait a while on that, I'm no longer convinced it's a legitimate way of doing it.


                                      I went back and found the actual "giveawayoftheday" that moderator "Allan" had provided a few days ago.

                                      Thank you for doing that!! From reading the description, it sounds like I could do the same thing manually by just going into Device Manager to see which drivers are being used by each device and then make backup copies of them?

                                      ossilix

                                        Topic Starter


                                        Rookie

                                        Re: Hard Drive Failing - ECC Errors - Windows XP
                                        « Reply #35 on: August 03, 2010, 06:59:14 PM »
                                        If the BIOS doesn't support 48-bit LBA, you aren't going to be able to access >137GB of data, and the drive itself will be recognized, if at all, as 137GB. the issue you've researched and the data you've found appears to be a mishmash of possible behaviour resulting from XP  before SP1a as well as implementation dependent BIOS issues. as you note you have SP1 so the OS issue (the one that the KB article cites as causing data loss) isn't a problem.

                                        If the BIOS is limited to 28-bit addressing, then it is fully possible for software that is unaware that the BIOS is limited in this fashion to add to a near maximum value; the OS value is still correct, but when the OS sends this to the BIOS, the BIOS only uses the first 28 bits of the 48-bit value. (or maybe it was the last bits, not sure, it's probably implementation specific). therefore, the address that the BIOS actually writes data and where the OS told the BIOS to write data don't match.

                                        I read that the BIOS isn't involved in writing to the HD (or in doing anything else) after the OS takes over from it, that once Windows loads BIOS hands all control over to it and Windows does everything by itself - is that wrong? How am I able to use my other 500gb external drive with no problems? And when I had the new unallocated 500gb in an external USB enclosure, it also saw the full size. Do those things happen because they connect via USB?

                                        Also, how can any software on a 120gb primary partition (eg C:\ ) attempt to write data beyond the 120gb? Wouldn't that be like Windows trying to write to the floppy drive once the C:\ drive got full?

                                        (BTW I'm not trying to argue, just trying to understand)

                                        Quote
                                        Corruption is the result. That of course only results if you are able to partition a drive larger then 137GB (not sure how one would do that, again, depends on the BIOS and specific implementation details)

                                        From within Windows SP1+ I think you can partition any size you want up to the 48-bit limit, since it's 48-bit capable.

                                        Quote
                                        It [Chaintech Apogee 7VJL] supports ATA-6(100mbps), and ATA-7(133mbps) With Bus mastering. since ATA-6 is the 48-bit LBA "fix" introduced by Maxtor, you should be fine.

                                        I actually found the same page before. Luckily I was able to find the manual and other things that came with it (big relief) - the manual says this:

                                        Quote
                                        - Supports 2 IDE ports up to 4 ATAPI devices
                                        - Supports up to PIO Mode 4 up to 16.6MBps, Multi Mode 4 up to 66MBps, Multi Word Mode 5 up to 100MBps and Multi Word Mode up to 133MBps with bus mastering
                                        -Bus Mastering software drivers for common multi-task operating systems

                                        However like you said, it still only sees 136gb. Would installing the Bus Mastering software made a difference? Or is it already installed?

                                        Quote
                                        Very true, and I do apologize for any offense or frustration I may have caused. I was under the impression that your data was wasting away while you sat and decided what to do, but if you indeed had your data backed up (perhaps I missed it mentioned before in my rush to express my self-import, heh) then it would be fine to take ones time.

                                        LOL No problem, I knew you were just trying to express the importance of doing this quickly. I apologize for being so defensive - during this research I have had many people treat me like a moron because I'm trying to learn what's happening and what the options are rather than just doing whatever the first person tells me to do (which in most cases so far has turned out to be exactly the wrong thing to do).

                                        BTW I don't mind just staying limited to the 120gb or so partition that I created to install Windows if that's the only surefire way to have it be stable. If I could just get the hardware working I would be grateful. :'( I'm feeling very pessimistic about the D-Link "cable is unplugged" problem.