Notebook computer won't boot up... generally speaking.

[GameAngel64]

My HP Pavilion Entertainment PC Notebook computer won't boot up.  Most of the time.  However, seemingly without any pattern or particular conditions it will occasionally start.  In fact I am on it right now.  Here are the specs per the "My Computer" properties screen:

Microsoft Windows XP
Media Center Edition
Version 2002
Service Pack 2

HP
AMD Turion 64 X2 Mobile
Technology TL-50
1.61GHz, 992 MB of RAM
Physical Address Extension

64.8 Free Gigabytes on the Hard Drive

Hopefully this info is sufficient because the next time I return to this post it'll probably be on my main computer, the desktop, being as this one typically will not boot up.

The exact symptoms are as follows.  I press the power button.  Assume that all peripherals (mouses, etc.) are disconnected, and there are no CDs in the drive or anything like that.  Sometimes the computer is plugged into the wall, sometimes it isn't.  The only difference is whether or not the "charging" LED is on or not.  But anyway... I hit the power button, and the LED light panel turns on like normal, the power light turns on, and, if it's plugged in, the AC Power light comes on.  However, the notable exception is that the hard drive light (I assume - the icon that looks like a stack of CDs?) does not come on.  When I initially hit the power button, the comp makes sounds like it wants to start.  A quick beep like normal, the fan runs for a moment, but then - dead.  Like the hard drive didn't take.  Like there is no communication there.  There is no illumination or anything on screen.  Sometimes the LED lights stay on for a while.  Usually the computer shuts off before too long.  

Occasionally the computer will remain on in this idle state, and every few seconds the LED light for the hard drive will blink, and when this light blinks the computer will repeat the "starting up" ritual sounds, but nothing happens, the hard drive LED light blinks off, and the screen never reacts.

It's not the battery because if I remove the battery and try to run it on power from the wall, it is exactly the same.

Messing with the computer's hardware is uncharted territory for me, but I followed some instructions and reseated the RAM, but it seemed to neither help nor hinder the frequency with which this computer starts.

I defragged not long ago, and it said I do not have to defrag this volume when I checked a couple days ago.

I did disk clean-up.

I did Scan Disk.  Twice.  First time I did 'scan for and attempt recovery of bad sectors.'  No prob.  Then I did Scan Disk again, with this option selected along with 'automatically fix file system errors.'  This required a restart.  So the computer went through its restart ritual but when it got to the part where it was supposed to boot up again, it hung like usual, before the "HP" logo appeared on screen, before anything.  So a long while later I tried to turn the computer on again and it worked, it said it was scheduled to perform the scan disk so it did, however I was away from the computer while it ran, and honestly now I can't remember for certain, but when I returned I think the computer was shut off.  Either way next time I turned it on, nothing was reported.

AVG, Ad-Aware, and Norton were run.  No viruses or notable Spyware detected.

If by some miracle the computer turns on and you can get to Windows, if you step away long enough for the screen to turn off, it will not turn on again.  You've lost it.  (So for the time being I've disabled those kinds of power saving features.  And forget about restarting it for program updates or anything like that!  AVG has been waiting to update forever, and can never complete it).

I don't think overheating is an issue, and I dusted it with a can of compressed air, of what little relevance that might be to this problem.  Wasn't particularly dusty anyway.

Generally this computer is only subject to light use, since the desktop computer is the "main" computer in this househould.

Computer's not too old... I think I only bought it a year ago, although now it might be closer to two years.

Any thoughts?  Is this a serious hardware issue that I will have to spend big bucks on to repair?  Thanks in advance, I know it was a lot to read, and I can work my way around software usually but I try and stay away from messing with the hardware too much!

[Deerpark]

It is definitely a hardware problem.
The problem here is that laptops are pretty hard to hardware troubleshoot, since the only hardware you can really replace yourself is the RAM and hard drive.
I'm guessing it isn't the hard drive since the laptop should be able to at least begin boot up without the hdd.
You can test the RAM for defects with Memtest86+
Download the ISO and burn to a CD. (Don't burn it as simple data disc, it will have to be burned as an image.)
Reboot the laptop with the CD in the drive and memtest will start automatically. It will run a series of tests. You should let it complete the tests at least a couple of times before you can give you RAM a clean bill of health.

But actually lets hope it is the RAM that's failing since they are easy and reasonably cheap to replace.

[Flip81]

what makes you think this is not a heat issue?  You say it will randomly shut off/hang.  Is the fan working properly?  Did you open up the back and make sure that it does not feel hot? 

If I were you I'd power it up on its side and see what happens. 

Another thing.  I doubt that this is a hard drive issue.  A hard drive with bad sectors would not cause a hard shutdown.  (or at least I've never heard of that)  I guess it could be the RAM, but usually when RAM goes bad the comp will not boot to the desktop. 

To me it sounds like either heat or a motherboard issue.

[GameAngel64]

It doesn't randomly shut off so much as persistently not start.  If it shuts off while in use, it only shuts off because the screen has been allowed to shut off (for power-saving reasons, hibernation, etc.), not for any other reason.

The comp doesn't boot to the desktop    Usually, anyway.  Once in a while I get lucky and make it to the desktop.  If that happens, everything is fine until I have to shut it down and try to turn it on again later.

[Flip81]

Reading through your post again I'd say the main culprit here is power.  Power is running through your motherboard the whole time it is on.  If it's not distributing the power from the battery or AC adapter to your internal components (hd, RAM, processor, northbridge, etc.) properly then I think these kind of random things can happen.  That is, "sometimes" it will boot to the desktop.  Sometimes it will power off.  Sometimes it won't cut on.  Sounds to me like your motherboard could be failing.  Bad problem to have I know.  Just my opinion. 

[patio]

Actually these symptoms occur on laptops with failing/bad batteries...how old is the unit ? ?

[Flip81]

That would make sense if the unit had these symptoms just running off the battery, however, the OP said that they occur with the AC plugged in. 

[Flip81]

One suggestion would be to get ahold of a multimeter and test your AC adapter.  It is possible that both your battery and AC adapter went bad.  If so, that would confirm the dead battery theory.

[GameAngel64]

I bought the notebook computer no more than two years ago.  It might be a bit less than that.  It would be uncanny if both the battery and AC adapter are dead/dying at the same time, but it might be better if that's what it is. 

I did the Memtest86+ bootup CD thing and here is what happened.  I put the CD in the drive before I shut off my computer the last time I had it running properly.  I shut down my computer.  Not long later I turned it back on so the CD would run, but now the LED lights flashed on for barely a second and then everything shut off without a sound.  I tried turning it on again a few seconds later and the same thing happened.  I decided to try turning it on one more time before going to bed and... the same.  Quick flash of the lights, no sound, everything turns off.  Thinking that this may be happening because I had JUST used the computer for like two hours, I decide I will try again in the morning.  This could be a vote for the "overheating" possibility, except that the computer won't boot up often even when it's been off for days, and it is very cool.

This morning I tried powering it on again with the CD in the drive, and now its response was more typical to how it acts when it doesn't want to boot up; lights come on (and stay on), fan runs, and the CD sounds like it's running, but there's nothing on screen, and periodically it stops running, the lights all blink, the computer makes a couple small beeps, and then the process repeats again.

I may try running the CD again later.

I'm thinking this is indicative of some of the less desirable possibilities being the case? 

EDIT:  I tried running the CD again.  This time, I got the computer to boot up without the CD in the drive.  Then, once I was at the desktop and everything, I put the CD in and did Restart.  However, instead of restarting, when it got to the point where it was supposed to reboot, it just shut down.  Not surprising.  I tried turning it back on again, and it did the usual beep, fan, no screen, the CD ran for a bit, and before too long the computer shut itself down.

EDIT 2:  Ooh boy, I got that Memtest to work and the RAM passed the test three times.  This is a bad sign, yes?

[patio]

No. If it passed it's a good sign...
But MemTest needs to run for awhile...there are more than 3 tests.
1 1/2 to 2 hours is usually sufficient depending on the speed of the machine.

[GameAngel64]

I say it's a bad sign because if it's not the RAM that means it's something more serious.

When I say I ran the test three times, I mean ALL the way through.  It had a column labeled "Passed" and underneath it it said "3."  So I assume that means it ran all tests three times?  I let in run for at least an hour and a half.

[GameAngel64]

Well I brought my computer over to the Geek Squad at Best Buy (first time I've ever done THAT) and the guy basically hit the power button and then gave it back to me, telling me it's the motherboard and that I'm basically screwed.  Yay.

[patio]

I would seriously consider getting a 2nd opinion...

[truenorth]

GameAngel64,You are currently being assisted by some of the best on the CH forum so i offer this advise knowing full well it will probably not solve your problem. However i note from your initial post that you say "AVG, Ad-Aware, and Norton were run." It has been stated many times that you should NEVER run 2 anti virus programs at the same time. Norton by itself in my humble opinion can be bad enough but to put another tiger in the cage with it can cause great grief and bad things to happen.Doubt this is at the route of the problem but it may eliminate a problem on other computers in the future.My choice would be to go with AVG alone. My money is on a heat generated issue.truenorth

[GameAngel64]

Huh?  I ran Norton first, and then when that was done I ran AVG.  Do you mean letting both programs run their virus scans at the same time, because that's not what I did.  I did all my scans separately.

Also, I uninstalled AVG thinking that MAYBE there was some off chance that I was having these problems because, as I said, AVG kept trying to update but never could because the computer could not restart properly.  However uninstalling AVG did not solve the problem.

I want to get a second opinion, but I don't know where else to go, except to perhaps a tech savvy acquaintance, but I don't know if they'll make any better/more correct of a diagnosis.  If it is the motherboard I don't know what I'm gonna do.  The thing is out of warranty by a few months, and I really don't want to have to get another computer, they're not exactly passing them out like candy.  I'm not exactly sure how effective an angry letter will be. 

I would like to think it's a heat issue, maybe then it could be repaired, but if the computer has not been run in days and it is cool to the touch, and it still doesn't boot, that doesn't seem right.  The fan seems to run fine, and it is not dusty.